Jul 06
“Wake up muscles we’re in New York now.” Casey Stengel
Another typical Mets fan
If you haven’t forgotten the weekend, keep on drinking! I’ll spare you the misery by not linking to the weekends posts. However, there were some great conversations happening here over the weekend.
For your Monday morning pleasure, I present to you The Amazin\’ Mets-terpiece Theatre VLOG-tacular – Special Edition
MLBTradeRumors
Link: If not Ike, who's on first? { I feel like I post... } – May 25, 11:19 AM
Last Night on the Farm - 5/24/13 { Looks like no return for... } – May 25, 10:42 AM
Link: The Second Half Push: Harvey, Montero,... { To the eye of the... } – May 25, 10:01 AMLink: The Second Half Push: Harvey, Montero,... { I agree with your post... } – May 25, 9:59 AM
Link: The Second Half Push: Harvey, Montero,... { you can never quantify a... } – May 25, 8:46 AM
133 comments
prismo
7/6/2009-8:04am at 8:04 am (UTC -4)
I drank a lot over the weekend, but it just wasn’t enough to quell the pain hidden deep within my soul. ;(
QnsNative718
7/6/2009-9:27am at 9:27 am (UTC -4)
Im crying as I type this.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-8:12am at 8:12 am (UTC -4)
It could have been worse. We could have gotten swept last weekend against the Yanks, too. Oh wait…
mrbill
7/6/2009-10:30am at 10:30 am (UTC -4)
lol
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-8:15am at 8:15 am (UTC -4)
You know the way a 1-0 deficit for this team seems like it’s 7-0? Well, this 4 game deficit seems like it’s 10 games. If the Phils mount any kind of a hot streak this week – say 5-1 – we are likely done after we go 1-5 and fall 8 games back by the All-Star Break.
Giants start training camp pretty soon at least.
None of what happened this weekend was Castillo’s fault
Mr. Mets Butler
7/6/2009-8:16am at 8:16 am (UTC -4)
Sad to say, but I couldn’t watch these games anymore after Wright and Santos goofs in game two. I instead took solace in the company of Corona’s and margaritas.
I have finally accepted that Omar will sit on his ass while the Phillies and Braves(already have) make a few noteworthy moves before the deadline to help themselves for the division race. I am disgusted with this team and its management/ownership, but I am also at peace finally. I will not be miserable this summer. Someone grab me another Corona! :>((
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-8:40am at 8:40 am (UTC -4)
The only way I want Omar to get off his a$$ is if the Phillies are about to pull the trigger on a Roy Halladay deal, which is something I can really see unfolding here. This would spell doom for 2010 as well. That is the only case in which I would trade the farm for Halladay and Rios. I’d imagine a trade of Mejia, Holt, and FMart (plus possibly a major leaguer) could get it done.
Other than that, I want Omar to sit and watch.
Mr. Mets Butler
7/6/2009-8:18am at 8:18 am (UTC -4)
I guess I’ll start preparing early for my fantasy football drafts. Hmmm…. what channel is NFL Network again?
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-8:42am at 8:42 am (UTC -4)
My eyes are set on training camp the ‘Skins in week 1.
udontmesswthejohan
7/6/2009-9:25am at 9:25 am (UTC -4)
J – E – T – S…JETS, JETS, JETS!!!
QnsNative718
7/6/2009-9:28am at 9:28 am (UTC -4)
Giants all day, every day.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:16am at 10:16 am (UTC -4)
We need a #1 receiver dude. I like the fact we are trying to build our own receiving core, but facts are facts. Plaxico severely hurt (if not killed) our chances at a repeat last year. The window of opportunity with this current group of players (though we are very young) is short, just like NFL careers.
All that being said, I think Eli is poised to have a career year. Even bigger if they can get Braylon or Boldin.
prismo
7/6/2009-10:19am at 10:19 am (UTC -4)
Ramses baby!
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:26am at 10:26 am (UTC -4)
i think he is going to be awesome, but i’m not sure he is going to help them this year.
funny thing is, before the draft i read a little blurb about him. he was the only guy i really wanted them to get going in. happy they got him. they just need to develop him. watching the highlights of him coming up with those fades in the corner of the end zone brought back memories of super bowls past…or at least a super bowl!
QnsNative718
7/6/2009-10:35am at 10:35 am (UTC -4)
As much as I thought Plax was a pansy who didnt like to get hit, he proved his value last December. There was no question that the Giants spiralled downward because of the lack of his presence.
With him and Toomer gone, I dont think we’re in good shape. Manning who isnt the most accurate qb got alot of help from the lanky Burress. With him gone, who do we have out there? Hixon, Smith, Tyree? No, we need that #1. I was hoping for TJ Housh, but thats not happening.
Wow, look at me. Talking Giants football on a Mets Blog in July.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-11:47am at 11:47 am (UTC -4)
That’s the kind of stuff that will get you banned from Mattsblog.
Mr. Mets Butler
7/6/2009-10:29am at 10:29 am (UTC -4)
Drafted Nicks in my rookie draft. Hope he will be a star. He’s got the tools! And I’m a Jets fan…lol
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:31am at 10:31 am (UTC -4)
Needless to say, I hope you got a steal!
Dude has some big hands. My fear is they don’t have much of a deep threat. I hope they can overcome that because their defense is going to be beastly. Osi is the best pick up of the offseason for any team. Period.
charlie_s
7/6/2009-9:10am at 9:10 am (UTC -4)
What’s weird is that everyone always says watching minor league baseball is more fun than watching the majors. After the last week or so, I can honestly say that I don’t agree.
However, I do question SNY’s decision to broadcast the Mets’ minor league affiliates instead of the big league clue, but I’m not a TV executive, so I’ll defer to their best judgement.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-9:13am at 9:13 am (UTC -4)
Yuk!
Joe R
7/6/2009-9:22am at 9:22 am (UTC -4)
This season is nuts. Every few days the mood around this team changes on cue. Before the start of the Phils series WFAN was saying how great you must feel as a Met Fan…we can be in first by the end of this series after all the injuries, this is amazing…I actually bought into it a bit and Why not?? Im a Met fan who can jump on a positive Met band wagon if it presents itself!!
The reality is we are just bad at this point. I mean we all say this and that, we are fielding a minor league team and smetimes I believe we just say this stuff out of anger…I THINK ITS REALLY TRUE…3 runs against that pitching staff in Citizen Bank Park with 1 coming from Nieve!! Not good…We are 4 back now and JUST when it looked like we might be able to execute the plan of staying within a few back til the break here we are!!
I hope this roller coaster and continue and somehow we win a couple against LA and Philly loses all their games so we can pick up 1 game…Hm…Just dont think Philly will lose at the rate they were. Very tough year..Nothing going our way.
charlie_s
7/6/2009-9:29am at 9:29 am (UTC -4)
Joe, due to the injuries, it’s true!
F-Mart
Murphy
Evans
Tatis
Valdez
Brown
A. Reyes
Reed
Cora
Nieve
Misch
Niese
Fossum
Dessens
Two these guys gets to spot start/relieve in a normal year.
udontmesswthejohan
7/6/2009-9:30am at 9:30 am (UTC -4)
Well, that was a depressing display of baseball. The Mets best scoring chance yesterday: walk, bunt hit, sac bunt, double play. Terrible.
Anyway, I’m trying to be positive, and I see two things that are positive that hopefully come out of this season.
One, the calls to break up the “core” will hopefully be silenced as the core has not been intact the entire season and can’t be blamed. What they do with Delgado at this point I guess depends on him (i.e. how he performs and how much cash he wants). Either way at least we get another go round with Beltran, Wright, and Reyes.
Two, maybe all the “grit” and “heart” people will finally shut up. This current team is trying and they are playing hard…they just aren’t very good. I don’t mean to denigrate guys who play the game with a lot of heart, but int he end, I’ll taketalent over heart and this team is a perfect example. It feels like 1993.
stickguy
7/6/2009-9:35am at 9:35 am (UTC -4)
I think they have to let Delgado go, although I suspect that if he comes back and manages to look reasonably OK and stays onthe field, Omar will offer him a deal. Probably not the worst thing, if it is cheap and 1 year (ans assuming there is nothing better out there), but knowing Omar, it will be his whole available payroll for three years!
I really think they should just let him go and move on. But, he is a true FA, so he quite likely waves bye bye if an AL team (DH, baby!) comes courting.
udontmesswthejohan
7/6/2009-9:38am at 9:38 am (UTC -4)
Yeah, I guess I would lean toward letting him go as well, but I was thinking last night, who plays first then. You certainly can’t go into next year hoping that Murphy can get it together. He has to make dramatic improvement int he second half to even consider giving him the job at 1B and letting Delgado go. By dramatic improvement I’m talking hitting .330 the rest of the way, popping some more HR’s, etc…
I was already fooled once by the Murphman, as were many others, not sure I want to be fooled twice.
prismo
7/6/2009-9:46am at 9:46 am (UTC -4)
No way Murphy should be the starting 1b next season. Before last season he was a mid-level prospect at best. He came up to the bigs and tore it up for a month or two. But this season he’s been consistently sub-par. Which part of that summary is the outlier?
Average fielder (at 1b), below average power, below average hitting.
Mr. Mets Butler
7/6/2009-10:32am at 10:32 am (UTC -4)
I think Murph will be traded when all is said and done. Just a hunch!
trs86
7/6/2009-10:35am at 10:35 am (UTC -4)
Agreed, something like Murphy for Teahen. They basically get a younger version of Teahen that has options.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:07am at 10:07 am (UTC -4)
He’ll be a Yankee too. They all will be.
stickguy
7/6/2009-9:31am at 9:31 am (UTC -4)
at least they wont lose today. That’s a positive.
Look, Right now, they are fielding a sub .500 to .500 at best team, talent wise. So say they are roughly equivelant to the Pirates or Royals (although KC might be better, I haven’t checked their record).
Anyway, my point is, those teams have less than all stars at most (if not all, think Grienke) positions. So they win some, lose some, have a few streaks either way, and finish below .500 based on talent.
That IMO is what will happen to the Mets, with, however, 1 big difference:
The ohter clubs at least have guys that can play their position. That is, they might not have a great 1B, 2B or LF, but at least they belong there (they “are” a 2B, etc.) So they can be expected to make all the plays, and play solid fundi ball.
The Mets give up more runs (and make their pitching look worse) with horrible D and Fundis (love that word now). But how much of that goes back to inexperience at a position? So Evans misses a cutoff assignment, or Murphy throws to the wrong base? almost to be expected.
Right now, they only have 3 guys playing their real position (at most, when Luis plays, and I hardly count him!) And Luis and Schnieder are adequate at best these days.
At least the Pirates with Laroche x2, wilson, the 2B (sanchez?) and 3 OFs playing in position put a “real” team on the filed.
and geez, it even extends now to the pitching, since they have a couple of BP guys in the rotation!
metsfan4decades
7/6/2009-10:06am at 10:06 am (UTC -4)
Spot on with this analysis. I’ve been making this same argument for a couple of weeks now. You can get away with a replacement filling in for a regular at a position that he doesn’t have much experience with for maybe a couple of days – or one 15 day DL stint for a regular. But doing it for 2 months plus with 5-6 players? Not going to remotely get good results with that scenario. And that’s exactly what’s happening – it glaringly shows….
Joe R
7/6/2009-10:07am at 10:07 am (UTC -4)
Does anyone really think Reyes is going to be fine after the break. This injury that seems so bizarre to everyone from management to the fans is just going to disappear!!???
Even more so IS THERE ANY CHANCE Beltran is going to come back after a few weeks off and be ready to go the rest of the way when, as much as I love the guy and he is my favorite player, his knees are the issue every DAMN YEAR!!
Hate to be so negative but i just dont see either one of these injuries being resolved to the off season. I know Beltran is a great player when healthy and like I said he is my favorite Met but maybe its time to trade him while we can get a ton for him?? I mean every year we find out he has been playing in pain and we say wow what a heart on this guy…which I agree with…but at some point it becomes an issue. I mean he had surgery on his knees to clean them up and what happens?? His knees go down again. I know this may be a huge mistake if he goes on to play another 4 years pain free putting up Beltran type numbers but maybe its time to cash in. IDK
Sorry for the negativity
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:10am at 10:10 am (UTC -4)
I wouldn’t trade Beltran. However, I would keep an eye on the standings. If this Philly lead ever gets to double-digits, i would make him an expensive part time player for the reast of the season.
prismo
7/6/2009-10:11am at 10:11 am (UTC -4)
Actually the other teams would be cashing in. Only a couple MLB teams (one being the Mets) are willing to take on payroll. In order to trade Beltran and his large salary for prospects, the Mets would have to fork over the vast majority of his pay.
In other words, it’s not going to happen.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:30am at 10:30 am (UTC -4)
Red Sox and Angels can afford him. I think he puts the Red Sox over the top vs. the Yanks.
Pedroia, Beltran, Youk, Bay, Drew, Papi, Lowell, Varitek, Lowrie
I think the Mets would ask for Lars Anderson, Buckholz, and Ellsbury.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:31am at 10:31 am (UTC -4)
It’s not happening.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:33am at 10:33 am (UTC -4)
If ANYONE should be traded this offseason it should be Reyes but I don’t see it.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:37am at 10:37 am (UTC -4)
It should be Wright. I’m sick of his DPs and Ks in big spots.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:43am at 10:43 am (UTC -4)
It won’t be Wright, too much of a PR hit.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:46am at 10:46 am (UTC -4)
I know.. I’m still frustrated by his DP yesterday and 2,000,000 Ks.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:49am at 10:49 am (UTC -4)
Agreed, but law of averages say he will have a big 2nd half.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:40am at 10:40 am (UTC -4)
Reyes and Parnell to Toronto for Scutaro, Halladay, and Rios.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:42am at 10:42 am (UTC -4)
Wow, that’s REALLY not happening.
saltygary
7/6/2009-11:24am at 11:24 am (UTC -4)
lol
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:48am at 10:48 am (UTC -4)
Reyes and Parnell may get us Scutaro and Rios, but you’d have to give up Johan to get Halladay back. Plus the only reason Jays are willing to trade Rios is to clear salary for Halladay.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:51am at 10:51 am (UTC -4)
Agreed, somewhat but they would not want to do Reyes in the Rios deal either as they want cash to sign Halladay.
Maybe Niese, Kunz and Murphy/Evans for Rios and a reliever would be a damn good deal for both.
saltygary
7/6/2009-11:26am at 11:26 am (UTC -4)
We already had Scutaro, he will turn 34, all set. If Reyes was healthy I wouldn’t be shocked if Toronto took him and Parnell for Doc H.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:29am at 11:29 am (UTC -4)
Why? It makes no sense for them. Halladay wants to be there and they can’t win with just Reyes. They will do every thing they can to get enough money to resign Halladay.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-12:22pm at 12:22 pm (UTC -4)
If you were Halladay, would you want to re-sign? That team has never given you a legit chance to win.
Reyes and Parnell gets you Halladay. A player like Reyes is almost as difficult to come by as a player like Halladay in his prime.
stickguy
7/6/2009-10:39am at 10:39 am (UTC -4)
not happening, but an interesting deal. Really depends on how close you think Anderson is to being ready. Could he take over (productively) 1B in 2010?
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:41am at 10:41 am (UTC -4)
I haven’t kept an eye on his numbers. Unless they are convinced that Ike Davis is the 1B of the future, they need to address that position sooner rather than later.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:32am at 10:32 am (UTC -4)
So… who do we play CF next year?
stickguy
7/6/2009-10:40am at 10:40 am (UTC -4)
well, in that trade scenerio, Ellisbury. ANd if you traded Beltran for other parts, F Mart I guess.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:45am at 10:45 am (UTC -4)
Who replaces Beltran’s production numbers? If you combined Ellsbury and FMart maybe. This trade is stupid.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:47am at 10:47 am (UTC -4)
The only way Wright, Beltran or Reyes gets traded is star for star and those trades don’t happen.
saltygary
7/6/2009-11:32am at 11:32 am (UTC -4)
Ellisbury has been so overrated. he has never matched what he did rookie year in ’06
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:36am at 10:36 am (UTC -4)
Since when did we become a small market team? Sell the players to get what in return? Couple prospects that may or may not pan out? That’s stupid.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:38am at 10:38 am (UTC -4)
Agreed, don’t understand this at all. Delgado, Church, Livan, Tatis, Schnieder, Cora those types are fine to dump but you don’t trade your stars for prospects if you are the Mets.
saltygary
7/6/2009-11:35am at 11:35 am (UTC -4)
But maybe you trade Reyes if you can get value for him. He has a cheap contract and his game is based on his speed. If his leg issues start flaring up again, he will lose range as a fielder, his slugging will drop and he will no longer intimidate pitchers by threatening to steal. If those pieces go away he will become a avr fielder with a poor OPS.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:41am at 11:41 am (UTC -4)
True, but you know you can’t trade him for prospects. IF you could get a core replacement for him then maybe, but again Star for star trades don’t happen.
saltygary
7/6/2009-12:04pm at 12:04 pm (UTC -4)
Agree I don’t want the prospects. But Maybe a decent 1b and reliever? To the Sox for one of their 20 starters?
trs86
7/6/2009-12:11pm at 12:11 pm (UTC -4)
Those 20 starters that you are mentioning are mostly unproven, the ones that are proven it’s cheaper for them to keep.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:30am at 10:30 am (UTC -4)
I see no reason why we are not courting the Jays for Rios. Otherwise look for guys like Teahen, Wiggy or Huff.
stickguy
7/6/2009-10:37am at 10:37 am (UTC -4)
I would take rios. At least he has the speed and glove to play a top notch OF. That would be nice to have in LF for a change.
Not sure what happened with his bat. He is just 28, so he should be peaking, not sliding, but the talent is there.
Maybe a change of teams and leagues would give him a nice boost?
He is overpaid relative to last off season, but still gonna be way cheaper than Holliday. Plus it is cost certainty.
maybe the speculation that he could be had for 2 stiffs by taking slary was just a fantasy by a Toronto sports writer?
IDK, but silling a 2010 hole with a player fo that quality would be nice. THen they just have to find a C and 1B that can hit, and will be good to go (giving up on my fantasy of Castillo disappering inthe off season for a moment!)
trs86
7/6/2009-10:40am at 10:40 am (UTC -4)
I actually am thinking about a combo of Thole and Santos at catcher in the 8 spot myself. No reason to waste money there when the only quality catcher out there is Molina.
stickguy
7/6/2009-10:41am at 10:41 am (UTC -4)
I touted the same tandem at one point. That looks fine by me, assuming by ST Thole has at least average ML quality catching skills!
trs86
7/6/2009-10:45am at 10:45 am (UTC -4)
Do we have that now?
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:46am at 10:46 am (UTC -4)
I agree with you 100%. Why not give Thole 60 starts at C and let’s see if Santos was lightning in a bottle or a solid catcher for a few years.
My only concern would be Thole’s defense. As long as he is adequate behind the plate, no need to spend money on that position.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:48am at 10:48 am (UTC -4)
Unless Molina will come in for 1 year 6 million or less I agree.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:44am at 10:44 am (UTC -4)
Yes Rios would be good. But I think Jays would want to get rid of Wells before Rios.
stickguy
7/6/2009-11:07am at 11:07 am (UTC -4)
I want a Porsche but that isn’t happening either.
Wells is as close to untradeable as anyone in BB.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:11am at 11:11 am (UTC -4)
Agreed, don’t know HOW much cash they would have to eat there.
saltygary
7/6/2009-11:38am at 11:38 am (UTC -4)
Ugh if Wells can’t pull it off in Toronto he end up jumping off the Whitestone within a week of coming here.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:39am at 10:39 am (UTC -4)
Because the Phils are probably courting them for Rios and Halladay. Just watch.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:41am at 10:41 am (UTC -4)
Why would the Jays do that and not to mention the Phillies don’t have enough to get it done or the payroll flexibility.
stickguy
7/6/2009-10:42am at 10:42 am (UTC -4)
payroll is an issue. combined those 2 make what, 25 million?
trs86
7/6/2009-10:44am at 10:44 am (UTC -4)
Yeah at least and the contracts don’t end this year. Besides, it would make no sense for them to dump Rios in the same deal as Halladay. They would get MUCH more out of Halladay by himself.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-10:49am at 10:49 am (UTC -4)
I think John Mayberry (who looks like he can be very good) will be the main piece in a deal for Halladay. Not to mention, the Phillies have young pitchers that have come up and had success on the major league level (Happ and Bastardo). If they are willing to give up Happ, Mayberry, and perhaps Madson, they should be able to get Halladay.
In a way, I almost hope that happens. Put me out of my misery early.
trs86
7/6/2009-10:52am at 10:52 am (UTC -4)
That’s no where NEAR enough. Besides, where do the Phillies come up with that cash?
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-11:45am at 11:45 am (UTC -4)
Gomez wasn’t nearly enough to get santana either. Halladay has a reasonable contract ($10MM?).
trs86
7/6/2009-11:55am at 11:55 am (UTC -4)
WAY different situation. They HAD to trade Santana and he held all the cards where he went.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-12:16pm at 12:16 pm (UTC -4)
Why is it a WAY different situation? They way I see it is, the market for Halladay is goign to be much more fruitful than the market for Rios. Both guys are making similar $$$. Toronto is falling out of the AL race faster than we are falling out of the NL race.
I think Philly will get Halladay. Pat Gillick still has some connections there and he is still working in the Phils front office.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-12:20pm at 12:20 pm (UTC -4)
TA 09, I really don’t think Halladay is being shopped now. If anything, he’ll be shopped after the season is over.
Jays FO will do everything to try to trade Wells and Rios to clear room for Halladay before thinking about trading him.
trs86
7/6/2009-12:22pm at 12:22 pm (UTC -4)
Halladay is NOT on the market. They want to win with him. They have him under contract next year too. So if they trade him it will be in the offseason when they have tried to extend the contract. They don’t have the money to extend him so they are trying to dump guys like Rios, Wells, Overbay to clear money.
Philly is NOT getting Halladay.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-12:32pm at 12:32 pm (UTC -4)
My question to you is, who is going to trade for guy slike Rios, Wells, or Overbay? There is no market for them. Rios and Wells are a shell of what they used to be. Those two are prime suspects as steroid users.
Joe R
7/6/2009-10:55am at 10:55 am (UTC -4)
I wonder how many games we would be up in the division if completely healthy this year. You can easily make an argument that we should be getting our 4th division crown this year lol. Almost like the Braves of the 90′s. Damn so frustrating…What could have been with this team…Maybe a minor little dynasty if a couple of pieces fell into place. I love these guys and hate to see them start disappearing i.e, Delgado and who knows who else. So close guys…so DAMN close!! Very depressing
trs86
7/6/2009-10:59am at 10:59 am (UTC -4)
Too many bad ideas though, Alou should have never been here. Lee should be in LF. Delgado should not be here to get injured, a guy like Overbay, or a youngin like Morales or even Dunn should be. The only knock I have on Omar and the Mets is that they never seem to more than 1 year at a time. I don’t know if that’s Omar or the Wilpons but I think it’s our biggest problem.
saltygary
7/6/2009-11:40am at 11:40 am (UTC -4)
Being up by “x” amount of games hasn’t really made a difference. Maybe being the underdog will work better.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-10:55am at 10:55 am (UTC -4)
The only reason Jays are trying to deal Rios is to clear room for Halladay. If Rios/Wells gets traded, Halladay stays in Toronto for another 95 years.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:00am at 11:00 am (UTC -4)
Agreed. That is why the Mets should help them out and get Rios. LOL.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:05am at 11:05 am (UTC -4)
Here is an idea, work out the deal with the Jays where you trade for Rios and Overbay. Clears 19 million, next year alone. Overbay gives us a a lower priced average 1B for this year and next. Trade Delgado in August as he would clear waivers because of salary.
That is how you buy your way out of this mess AND get better for next year.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:10am at 11:10 am (UTC -4)
Next year’s lineup
Reyes, Castillo, Beltran, Wright, Church, Rios, Overbay, Santos/Thole in some order.
stickguy
7/6/2009-11:16am at 11:16 am (UTC -4)
I didn’t copy. It just takes me 5 minutes to type my long winded posts.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:19am at 11:19 am (UTC -4)
At least we are on the same page.
stickguy
7/6/2009-11:15am at 11:15 am (UTC -4)
If they get those 2 for nothing of importance by taking on salary, go for it.
LF and 1B are 2 gaping holes right now, and for next year. That fills them both with guys that aren’t cheap, but are at least productive, and play good D (a nice change).
Omar almost has no work left in the off season, other than trying to unload Castillo (had to get that in).
Tweak as needed:
Reyes
Rios
Wright
Beltran
Church
Overbay
THole/Santos
2B (castillo? Hudson?)
Lots of speed, lots of D, and no “thumper” but power from plenty of guys. A good looking Citifiled team. And it really should make the pitching better too.
Bench can have Evans for OF/1B (if not traded), Cora (or equiv.), whichever catcher isn’t starting, and 2 other guys not names Tatis.
So, all Omar would have left on the off season to-do list is maybe 1 good SP, a couple of pen arms, and a couple of bench guys. So he should be able to spend all his time trying to upgrade 2B!
trs86
7/6/2009-11:20am at 11:20 am (UTC -4)
I don’t see us getting a new SP either.
It will be the same rotation we have this year and Niese, Holt and Mejia pushing a resigned Livan.
stickguy
7/6/2009-11:25am at 11:25 am (UTC -4)
probably the same crew, but that is OK. Pelf and Santana aren’t going anywhere, I expect we are stuck with Ollie (maybe he really will “get it” better now?) and hopefully Maine does come back helathy finally.
I don’t think we will see Livan though. I’m guessing the annual 2nd half swoon is happening againg. I think he just wears out.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:27am at 11:27 am (UTC -4)
I agree he may push himself out of the rotation in the 2nd half but I still see him resigned and then giving way to Niese, Holt or Mejia.
stickguy
7/6/2009-11:30am at 11:30 am (UTC -4)
as long as it is a minor league deal, go for it.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:32am at 11:32 am (UTC -4)
Agreed, hopefully no Omar 2/8 deal.
stickguy
7/6/2009-11:22am at 11:22 am (UTC -4)
This Rios + overbay concept deal, or something similar, is exactly the type of bold move Omar should be trying to work out (and of course I he just might be. I am sure he isn’t just sitting around watching TV all day). Helps immensely now, fills glaring holes for 2010, and while not cheap, wouldn’t break the bank for 2009, and easily fits in 2010.
Beyond that, and especially if they fall too far back (even with said deal), try to have a garage sale.
If Delgado comes back with some life in his bat, try to pawn him off on an AL team as a DH. Sheffield, same thing. And if they really did get Rios and Overbay, they are both extraneous.
Move whoever else you can for depth (of the guys not coming back anyway). ALthough at this point, who is that? Schneider? Heck, maybe soeone could use Castillo?
Heck, if they got a new 1B and LF, they could trade sheff, delgado, castillo and Schneider, and impprove their chances of making a run for it!
I doubt Wagner or Putz would be back in time to prove healthy and productive enough to trade, but who knows.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:26am at 11:26 am (UTC -4)
I think that if they get Rios and Overbay that Delgado for sure should be dumped either way. Now basically those two, Rios and Overbay account for 3 million LESS than Wagner and Delgado. Then you can spend any remaining money on BP pieces to possibly resign Putz or another setup man and remodel the bench by resigning Cora and getting some real backups.
stickguy
7/6/2009-11:32am at 11:32 am (UTC -4)
does make for a much nicer looking team.
Wonder how badly Toronto wants to unload the salary? I would give up Murphy in a sec, but what else? I am afreaid to give up Neise, but what else would they want? Or maybe the 19mill + murph man is enough!
trs86
7/6/2009-11:33am at 11:33 am (UTC -4)
I would do a package of Murpphy/Evans, Niese and Kunz. That should be PLENTY.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:34am at 11:34 am (UTC -4)
Prefer for it not to be Niese but…
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-11:49am at 11:49 am (UTC -4)
I’m all for it, so long as we treat Overbay like the fans in Milwaukee did. It was like an event every time he batted.
wannybackstra
7/6/2009-12:28pm at 12:28 pm (UTC -4)
I’m not a fan of Overbay per se. But he’s the type of line drive hitter that might prosper in Citifield. Plus, his glove would be quite a relief.
Nick Evans would have room on the team has his caddy against tougher lefties.
saltygary
7/6/2009-11:49am at 11:49 am (UTC -4)
The biggest trade issue that I see is bringing on more salary. Rios would be a good add, but he is very expensive. So far the word out of Mets land is they are willing to bring on only 5mil but will that still be the case?
Probably the biggest indicator is tickets sales and how they have been effected. Living in NH I try to hit 2 games a season but I am not spending the money on it this year. I just can’t justify the cost for what is being put on the field right now. So if other fans are thinking the same thing how will the Wilpons be comfortable dropping another 5mil on a sinking ship? And it’s not only ticket sales. There maybe plenty of seats sold but the tickets aren’t being used (tickets bought by brokers)so there aren’t any fans having a Taco out back with Mr. Cerrone. Less food and Merch bought is less money in Madoff’s pocket.
trs86
7/6/2009-11:57am at 11:57 am (UTC -4)
And not only that, less people turning on the radio, tv, internet, buy merchandise. You lose a lot of money when you are the Mets and you don’t compete.
saltygary
7/6/2009-12:05pm at 12:05 pm (UTC -4)
And if you don’t put stupid patches on the jersey. Would of totally gotten a new jersey this year if it wasn’t for the lame Dominoes patch.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-11:58am at 11:58 am (UTC -4)
I still think we need a solid #2 SP if we’re not going to do anything this year. If Delgado comes back and does half way decent, I would still sign him for a 1 yr contract 8-10 mil. I’d definitely would trade for Rios and give up our prospects, but then if Holliday is available via FA, I’d consider that route too (since he will get approx similar contract). And then really go for that #2 pitcher behind Johan. (Joel ‘Cy Young’ Pinero will be a FA!!!)
So next year’s line up would be
Reyes
Castillo
Wright
Beltran
Holliday/Rios/Delgado
Delgado/Holliday/Rios
Church
Santos
Johan
A Legit #2
Pelf
Maine
Perez/Livan/Whoever…
KRod
trs86
7/6/2009-12:10pm at 12:10 pm (UTC -4)
LOL about Pinero. Thing is that unless you trade Maine there is not a lot of room. Niese, Holt and Mejia will have to have a spot soon. I don’t expect all or even 2 of them to work out but I expect one of them to.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-12:18pm at 12:18 pm (UTC -4)
It’s always a good problem to have when you have too much SPs. Niese, Holt and Mejia may work out, but it’ll be their first season. If we want to go for WS ring, I still think big time SP will definitely help.
trs86
7/6/2009-12:20pm at 12:20 pm (UTC -4)
But thing is it will have to be a 1 year deal guy UNLESS you trade Maine or Pelfrey which I don’t see happening.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-12:25pm at 12:25 pm (UTC -4)
Guys like Bedard or Lackey can come in short term contracts. Bedard definitely is injury prone and will not get a long term contracts (and he may come real cheap too)
But I see what you are saying. Ollie’s contract will be in the rotation, hence no room for another SP. I would trad Maine if that’s the case. Maybe Maine could be the part of Rios trade.
trs86
7/6/2009-12:36pm at 12:36 pm (UTC -4)
Would not really make sense for the Mets then. LOL. Tough crowd.
trs86
7/6/2009-12:16pm at 12:16 pm (UTC -4)
By the way, it’s early but DeRosa is 0/9 since coming back to the NL.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-12:18pm at 12:18 pm (UTC -4)
That’s good enough to be our everyday 2B, 1B, or LF.
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-12:25pm at 12:25 pm (UTC -4)
LOL. If he Ks alot, he can be our 3B too!
wannybackstra
7/6/2009-12:29pm at 12:29 pm (UTC -4)
If Tatis is really duplicative of Tatis (and I think he is) he’ll have to hit into 2 or 3 double plays among those 9 at bats.
wannybackstra
7/6/2009-12:30pm at 12:30 pm (UTC -4)
If DeRosa…
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-12:31pm at 12:31 pm (UTC -4)
Jerry will love him!!
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-12:35pm at 12:35 pm (UTC -4)
…and still hate Church!
DNDJohan aka kistics
7/6/2009-12:45pm at 12:45 pm (UTC -4)
and Castro!.. oh wait…
saltygary
7/6/2009-12:33pm at 12:33 pm (UTC -4)
On another note Ollie starting this week could be extremely detrimental to his tenure with this club. If this guy blows up (which he probably will) how will he be able to take the mound at Citi without being a total headcase. Ollie Pitching + $1 beer night would probably level Queens. This should of done that while Shea was still standing, would of cost the team less money in demolition costs.
There's Always '09
7/6/2009-12:37pm at 12:37 pm (UTC -4)
Ollie should spend less time on his fauxhawk and more time in bullpen sessions and on the treadmill, per Dan Warthen.
stickguy
7/6/2009-12:38pm at 12:38 pm (UTC -4)
For some reason, I think Ollie will come out and be OK, if not pretty good. he sounded really happy to have his knee feeling good, and his velocity back. He may have also been working on some things (pitching wise) down there, which can only help.
trs86
7/6/2009-12:39pm at 12:39 pm (UTC -4)
I actually think Ollie will come back and be the 2nd half Ollie from last year. Of course I am still drunk and drinking as well.
stickguy
7/6/2009-12:35pm at 12:35 pm (UTC -4)
Of Niese, Hole and Mejjia, only Neise is likely to be in the rotation this year, or to start 2010. IMO of course. He is just further along in development, and more “established”. Plus he has had his taste already.
Mejjia is shut down right now (not sure if it is to protect his innings, or medical). Holt is just back from his ankle sprain.
So, if none traded (and I would try not to, can never have enough pitching!) I could see Neise taking over the 5th spot this year at some point, or certainly out of ST next year, with Holt starting in AAA and being the mid season call up guy.
Mejia has the stuff, but probably needs more time being coddled in the minors before you can expect him to come up and handle a full workload. But, he would be a great candidate for the Joba/Hughes treatment, getting his feet wet in the pen, then moving back to the rotation.
trs86
7/6/2009-12:38pm at 12:38 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed, my original point is that at least one of them will most likely push for a spot within 2 years. Thus there is no room for a longterm contract SP unless someone is traded. Now if Niese is traded then you have some time with Holt and Mejia.
wannybackstra
7/6/2009-2:06pm at 2:06 pm (UTC -4)
Mejia is 19 and might be the youngest pitcher in AA. He’s not sniffing the majors this year and probably not next year either.
He’s been shut down with some minor stiffness and also to conserve innings (I could be wrong about this but I can swear I read it somewhere).
Holt got spanked around his first start back from his ankle injury and then pitched better in his second start. I could see Holt making an appearance in Sep. 2010 or earlier if there’s an emergency or if he is too dominant in AA-AAA to hold back.
It should not happen this year unless the Mets are playing for something and a power arm in the pen will really make a difference.
stickguy
7/6/2009-12:41pm at 12:41 pm (UTC -4)
I am actually hoping the the current mess, and the potential fan backlash (resulting in lost revenue) works to our (the fans) favor. The Wilpons seem content to punt the season (and conserve payroll $$) if the fans were OK and coming out. But, if they start getting hit in the wallet, the best answer might be to take on a little extra salary this year (in advance of doing it next year).
So, using the Rios/Overpay scenerio, it might add a bit more than 5mill, but if they have to do it off season anyway, it could end up saving them money this year (by keeping revenue up).
Sometimes you gotta spend money to make money!
trs86
7/6/2009-1:32pm at 1:32 pm (UTC -4)
AGREED