Once again it’s time to grab your favorite morning drink, kick your feet up, and get your daily dose of Mets in the Papers.
Anthony DiComo, “Castillo’s Health Bodes Well For The Future”
Far more surprising than Castillo’s production — an average well over .300 and an on-base percentage floating around .400 — has been his health. In a season in which seemingly no Met can stay off the disabled list, Castillo — he of training room infamy — ranks third on the team in games played. And the two men in front of him, David Wright and Daniel Murphy, are both more than seven years his junior.
Anthony DiComo, “Mets Fall in Ninth On Long Night in Atlanta”
After the game, though, both manager Jerry Manuel and the losing pitcher, Francisco Rodriguez, were far more critical of Murphy’s play on Anderson’s leadoff double. Entering the inning, Murphy was hugging the right-field line in a classic no-doubles defensive alignment. The idea is that even if Anderson hits a perfectly-placed ball down the line — which he did — the first baseman can at least put a glove on it and hold him to a single.
Ray Glier, “Just When You Think the Mets Can’t Get Worse …”
All the labor, however, was ruined in a disappointing ninth inning, just another chapter to a disappointing season.
Bart Hubbuch, “Maine’s Next Start Set for Sunday”
John Maine came away physically unscathed from his first post-DL start last weekend and is scheduled to make his next start Sunday at Citi Field against the Nationals.
Bart Hubbuch, “Parnell Still On Shaky Ground”
“I would like to see a little better command of the fastball, actually,†Manuel said of Parnell. “The high volume of pitches concerns me a little bit in going forward as a starter. That tells me there are some command issues that need to be addressed.â€
David Lennon, “Frankie Says Murphy Blew It”
“It looked like a foul ball all the way,” K-Rod said. “But regardless, you’ve got to stop the ball, somehow, some way. After that the game fell apart.”
Adam Rubin, “Daniel Murphy’s Fielding Erros Are Costly As Mets Lose Braves, 5-4″
Murphy committed his 10th error since moving to first base when he then booted Ryan Church‘s grounder, allowing David Ross to score all the way from second base with the winning run. “I don’t understand why he just didn’t block the ball and keep it in play,” Jerry Manuel said. “After he muffed the ball he seemed to panic.” Â
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66 comments
metsfan4decades
9/17/2009-11:06am at 11:06 am (UTC -4)
That error by Murph last night to lose that game in the 9th…..let’s just say it was the summation of everything that’s wrong with this team this year. I’m getting to the point where I hold my breath almost expecting these things to happen.
Murphy is a long way from being an everyday 1st baseman. Love his attitude and work ethic but trying to learn this position in the big leagues – well, you can see by the error – ERRORS – on that one play last night, that it’s not the preferred method. Will he be able to play a competent first base? Maybe – probably. Will he ever have Keith Hernandez like instincts there? I’m really doubting it…..
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-11:09am at 11:09 am (UTC -4)
According to Rubin, Jenrry Mejia (a 19 year old who was the youngest player in AA and was injured during his only season there) has a chance to make the team next year as a reliever.
The Mets really need to stop rushing every player along. While it worked with David Wright — he’s a different breed than most — it has not been a very successful strategy with FMart, Pelfrey, Heilman, Murphy, Evans, Niese and others whose growing pains have been detrimental to the Mets and to the players’ confidence levels.
Who knows how many minor leaguers career’s have suffered because of their aggression — while Ruben Tejada seems to have handled it well, I’m certain that there are others who have not.
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-11:17am at 11:17 am (UTC -4)
was it speculation on his part, like Rubin saying he might be ready or mets officials say he might be ready?
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-11:21am at 11:21 am (UTC -4)
It’s unclear. He says sort of matter of factly.
JoeR
9/17/2009-11:39am at 11:39 am (UTC -4)
Im sorry…I really dont wish bad on anyone, but I must admit i am happy Murphy is having a bad week. I dont like seeing him get called out by KRod or Manuel but I am glad he is making some mistakes because i dont want this team going into Spring training thinking this guy is our starting 1B. We all know if he had a hot 3 weeks to the end of this year he would be annointed our starter and the talk would be how he turned the corner and will be a great defensive guy while hitting .300 15-20 HR and driving in 80!
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-12:36pm at 12:36 pm (UTC -4)
very true. better to let play the Tatis role.
stickguy
9/17/2009-12:43pm at 12:43 pm (UTC -4)
murphy on the bench getting 3-4 games a week filling in is fine by me. He might not be great at any of them, but he has experience as a professional at 4 or 5 positions.
Give him a crash course at C in the off season too. He has had some nice PH ABs, and a guy like that is valuable to have around.
stickguy
9/17/2009-12:41pm at 12:41 pm (UTC -4)
I decided the pelfrey for Fielder deal (a “what if/would you” from last night) would actually be a good one for the mets. Man, that guy is having a monster year with the bat.
then load up on mid teir SP, and find a cheaper serviceable solution for LF, and good to go.
And sad to say, I am actually willing to roll the dice on a low base, incentive type 1 year deal for Delgado (asusming he gets nothing better elsewher( if they can find a big bat for LF. Heck, just blow the wad and sign Holliday, and get a plug bat for 1B for a year, until Davis is ready.
I miss having a glove like Keith or Olerud at 1B. ANd Feielder at this piont is even up to average with the glove.
stickguy
9/17/2009-12:45pm at 12:45 pm (UTC -4)
How about Laroche? Based ont eh strong year he is having, any thougts on trying to snag him if he is relatively affordable? Probably take a 3 year deal though…
I prefer either a true stud like Prince, or a 1 year filler (or a guy that can shift to the OF, just in case Davis really makes it soon)
metsfan4decades
9/17/2009-12:50pm at 12:50 pm (UTC -4)
You know, I’ve been on the fence concerning Jerry and his managerial skills this year. Was thinking that injuries played a huge part and you can only do so much with what you’ve got.
But I’ve jumped off that fence now. Last night sealed it for me. Why did he pull Parnell in the 4th when he was struggling? Are they, or are they not, trying to see if he’s got what it takes to be a starter? This season is long since lost so why not leave him out there to see if he can make the pitches he needs to, to get out of that jam?
Coupled with I’ve never been a fan all season with many of his BP moves AND remembering this team making mental mistakes and bonehead plays way back in April and the mixed messages like ‘Church is my staring RF’, but then constantly platooning him – well….think I’ve made up my mind.
We need a better manager.
stickguy
9/17/2009-12:54pm at 12:54 pm (UTC -4)
jerry is an idiot, and I want him gone.
he knows he is on a short leash, so everything he is doing now is more about saving his job that developing any particular player (IOW, the long term good of the team and organization).
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-2:07pm at 2:07 pm (UTC -4)
Amen.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-3:18pm at 3:18 pm (UTC -4)
Glad to have you on board this train, which is a wise one.
Jerry is like Willie without having been on loads of winning teams.
A glad hander, a giggler after brutal losses, and a fraud when it comes to being a serious manager in ANY way.
What has he taught anyone? Who exactly does he get the most out of?
Jerry must go, and I again give props to Wanny for being the first to call for this loser’s dismissal.
I NEVER root for us to lose, but if this play continues, the one good thing is that it will mean the end of this jackass.
How can it be good to start next year with this walking reminder of three rancid seasons in a row, when, again, he teaches nothing, presides over a season-long lack of fundies, does not have his players’ respect (see Johan and Wright for starters), etc etc etc
trs86
9/17/2009-3:25pm at 3:25 pm (UTC -4)
I agree and said it when that closed door meeting occured. I still think that the players sit HIM down and that meeting and told HIM to shut the hell up. Which would explain why he came out backtracking on everything he said. I hope the poor play and errors continue as those are just as reflective on him as they are the players.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-3:39pm at 3:39 pm (UTC -4)
I agree, and I still think you were 100% right about Wright targeting Jerry when he said people weren’t prepared a couple of months back….
stickguy
9/17/2009-3:28pm at 3:28 pm (UTC -4)
c’mon Kong, don’t hold back!
anyway, I agree 100%. basically, while this season might not be Jerry’s “fault”, he isn’t making it any better. Frankly, IMO, he brings nothing to the table.
just clear out Jerry and all the coaches, and start fresh. And I don’t even care about getting some ancient retread (including Bobby V.) I would love to see a fresh young guy ready to make his mark. Timmy Tuefel? Gotta be soe choices. Basically, find the next Scosia.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-3:41pm at 3:41 pm (UTC -4)
LOL!
Teufel could very well be the next Scioscia/Gardenhire. Loved him as a player, he made the very most of his talent, he is a serious guy, and might be the best bet to be the next surprisingly good manager.
I would be A-OK with Bobby V, or Buck Showalter, or even Davey J, although that last one is probably more sentiment than intelligence talking….
stickguy
9/17/2009-3:47pm at 3:47 pm (UTC -4)
Davey? No. The man is about 100 years old at this point, and I think the game has passed him by.
make a clean start with someone like Timmy T. Besides, maybe they can plwo the $4mill/year they will save on the contract into some more pitching!
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-3:51pm at 3:51 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed….Davey is my Gil Hodges, but he is the past, not the future.
Love the Teufel idea, and hell, if you couple some idea with plowing more dough into pitching, I would agree to just about anything!
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:02pm at 4:02 pm (UTC -4)
I’d take Dallas Green, Jeff Torborg, Art Howe or George Bamberger if it meant getting rid of the Gangsta.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-4:18pm at 4:18 pm (UTC -4)
If dead guys are being considered, gotta go for Gil Hodges!
trs86
9/17/2009-1:23pm at 1:23 pm (UTC -4)
I too like Stick have gotten to the point where I would think about bringing Delgado back if he would take a Hudson deal. 3M with 5M in incentives. That would allow us to focus on SP and LF and that LF guy not have to be a HR hitter.
stickguy
9/17/2009-2:53pm at 2:53 pm (UTC -4)
the key is if it is a 1 year deal (essentially Delgados opportunity to prove he is healthy and can still be productive). I would suspect too he might like the NL so he can still play the field. Not sure why, but he just gives the vibe of someoen that isn’t yet ready to be a full time DH.
anyway, getting some cheap power out of 1B, and having no blockage of Davis (assuming, of course, he is ready by 2011 to step in) would be great.
THen they can spend some money to upgrade LF (holliday might be too much..), and can stay cheap at C. And then have the money for a new SP.
Just for kicks, if they did get holliday too, this line up (if delgado can stay on the field and still hit) could do some damage:
Castillo
Reyes
wright
beltran
holliday (or ??, maybe Uggla? Someone else?)
delgado
francouer
Catcher (what the heck, santos/Thole)
4 speed guys up top, and power form 3 (hopefully) all the way through 7. and even 8 isn’t a comeplete black hole.
Call me crazy, but this lineup can score some runs.
Oh, and for when Delgado goes down, plug in a vet bat or davis when ready.
trs86
9/17/2009-2:59pm at 2:59 pm (UTC -4)
Crazy.
metsfan4decades
9/17/2009-2:59pm at 2:59 pm (UTC -4)
Looks like a heck of a lineup to me. I too am of the mind now that signing Delgado for 1 year (if cheap enough) might not be a bad idea, considering what’s available on FA this year…
trs86
9/17/2009-3:01pm at 3:01 pm (UTC -4)
Biggest thing is what Stick said, taking a 1 year deal. None of the other decent 1B prospects will be available.
trs86
9/17/2009-2:59pm at 2:59 pm (UTC -4)
But no I like it. I think however, IF we resign Delgado then we may want to go with a little cheaper in LF and then focus on our terrible staff.
stickguy
9/17/2009-3:24pm at 3:24 pm (UTC -4)
if they sign Delgado, LF can go a lot of ways. Holliday was just the big name to throw out. And no bay, that IMO will end up being a disaster.
But, some solid production would be enough from LF.
I still can’t figure out what happened to Matt Murton. No one claimed him?
They should be able to find a mid-range guy not too expensive for LF, and that could be good enough. Especially if it was a bat that can play 1B too.
Would they go with a rotation, say Pagan and Carter? Too risky?
how about this. If they get delgado reasonably, and cover LF and the bench without breaking the budget, stay cheap at catcher (thole, etc.), and plow all the money into pitching?
that a good plan?
say:
Castillo
reyes
wright
beltran
delgado
francouer
LF
C
santana/lackey/myers/pelfrey/ollie/neise/neive, etc.
trs86
9/17/2009-3:28pm at 3:28 pm (UTC -4)
THAT IS THE BEST PLAN I HAVE SEEN< SERIOUSLY.
You should go live with that one tomorrow.
It does not solve right away our offensive issues but it attemps. Between Evans, Pagan, Sullivan, and Carter LF would be passabel and 1B with Delgado and Murphy being his caddy would most likely offer league average production.
Then you ahve taken our in shambles pitching staff and turned it into very acceptable. All that and you for sure have stayed UNDER budget. 16 for Lackey, 8 for Myers, 6 for Delgado.
STICK for GM!!!!!
stickguy
9/17/2009-3:42pm at 3:42 pm (UTC -4)
I am available…
even better, it is pretty simple (so the Mets FO can understand and hopefully execute), and on top of that, the farm is protecteded and allowed to grown and develop.
Plenty of depth left too.
You got the contacts ye tto send this to Omar?
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-3:48pm at 3:48 pm (UTC -4)
I love it.
Especially the “plow all the money into pitching” part.
Signing Lackey must be job 1, and Myers or someone else like him, and a good setup man, and if everyone is healthy, we will have enough offense to win.
As long as SOMEONE sets up a clinic in the spring to teach guys how to stay healthy and how to run the damn frigin bases……
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-3:54pm at 3:54 pm (UTC -4)
Keith Law said today in his ESPN chat that a healthy Beltran, Wright, Reyes and Santana will be good enough to win.
I agree and note that three of the four are hitters… Santana needs support on the mound.
I wouldn’t spend big money on a hitter unless Holliday somehow fell into our laps.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-3:58pm at 3:58 pm (UTC -4)
I completely agree.
And a platoon of Santos and Thole might be surprisingly good, as may Francoeur.
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:01pm at 4:01 pm (UTC -4)
If the idea is to spend $6m or so to keep Delgado, I think it is necessary to debate Johnson v. Delgado.
Sure, Delgado has the greater power potential. But Johnson is probably the better all around player. And Delgado might be the one guy who is a better bet than Johnson to miss time at this point.
But I think Delgado’s perceived willingness to take a one year deal is big too.
trs86
9/17/2009-6:56pm at 6:56 pm (UTC -4)
I like Johnson and know you love some OBP, however, I still think sometimes you can sacrifice that for HR. I did some research this morning for Fongy on HR and what they mean in a playoff race. It’s on the last post of yesterday.
metsfan4decades
9/17/2009-4:43pm at 4:43 pm (UTC -4)
I’m not sold on Myers, but other than that, looks like a good plan to me.
Myers makes me nervous. I think we can do better than him to go with the rest, no?
trs86
9/17/2009-6:57pm at 6:57 pm (UTC -4)
I think it’s about potential vs price there. You get Lackey and then spend 6M on Myers who if on can be a #2 as well but if not can be in the pen and you only wasted 6M.
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-4:10pm at 4:10 pm (UTC -4)
I can’t believe you guys, today.
So we’re upgrading the offense by only bringing back Delgado who is coming off surgery? Sounds very risky. What if he can’t swing for power becaue he has nagging hip problems?
I agree that SP must be the number one priority, but we don’t need more than one #2. Maine, Pelf and Ollie should be the 3-5 starters, unless they’re injured. Especially if bringing in two pitchers means just covering at LF.
If you guys remember the beginning of the season when Ollie was down, we were still getting lots of QS. It was the offense who wasn’t producing.
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:16pm at 4:16 pm (UTC -4)
I’m not advocating bringing back Delgado but I will point out that the Mets were 15-10 this season in games in which Delgado, Beltran, Wright and Reyes all played.
I would prefer to have someone more reliable than Delgado too, however.
trs86
9/17/2009-6:59pm at 6:59 pm (UTC -4)
So would I, I am just expecting Johnson to ask for more than 1 year too.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-4:20pm at 4:20 pm (UTC -4)
I am 100% AGAINST bringing Delgado back, and VERY in favor of Nick Johnson, if he is not too overpriced.
stickguy
9/17/2009-4:22pm at 4:22 pm (UTC -4)
Johnson is not going to be a power bat. And who knows how much he stays on the field. I also don’t want to commit to any 1B for more than 1 year (or 1+ option), unless it is A Gon or Fielder level guy.
Still, if Nicky can’t find a job and can be had cheap on a ST deal, he is certainly better thanMurphy, but I doubt the Mets will spend the 5 mill on that percieved upgrade.
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:33pm at 4:33 pm (UTC -4)
Delgado as a Met: .267 .351 .506 .857
Johnson’s career: .275 .402 .450 .852
Johnson is not a homerun hitter but he’s not powerless. I think he’d hit a fair amount of doubles at Citifield. A very productive hitter overall.
Neither is a good bet to stay healthy.
I doubt Johnson would be keen on a one year deal.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-4:39pm at 4:39 pm (UTC -4)
Other than one horrific injury in 2007, Johnson stayed mostly healthy in 2006 and this year as well.
He can sit here and there to get Murph some at bats and rest.
Johnson for 2 yrs/10 mil if necessary and Lackey, and then spend what’s left on a setup man.
If we are not spending too much more than that, and we cannot find a cheap LF, let Murph and Tatis platoon out there.
trs86
9/17/2009-7:01pm at 7:01 pm (UTC -4)
In LF, Murphy again. Oh God please no. LOL. I have to actually run from that one. Same way he runs from balls.
trs86
9/17/2009-7:00pm at 7:00 pm (UTC -4)
That’s the kicker. Delgado in my mind takes a Hudson type deal around 4M and up to 8M with incentives.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-4:35pm at 4:35 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t care if he isn’t a big HR hitter, and he will almost surely hit at least 15. Secondly, he had one horrific injury which cost him 2007 and much of 2008, but how many games did he miss in 2006 and 2009, to go along with an identical .428 OBP each year?
If this guy can be had for 5 mil/per, I say sign him for two years, put him in the two hole, and pencil in 10 more RBI each for Beltran and Wright.
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-4:38pm at 4:38 pm (UTC -4)
Nick makes 5.5 this year, so he likely gets a raise. Otherwise I totally agree.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-4:39pm at 4:39 pm (UTC -4)
Good point….thanks; I don’t look up contract $$$ and appreciate you pointing that out.
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:41pm at 4:41 pm (UTC -4)
Would he be insulted by 2 years $13m?
stickguy
9/17/2009-4:20pm at 4:20 pm (UTC -4)
spoilsport.
With Dlegado, he would somehow have to prove that he could still produce. That is why a cameo now would have been useful. Otherwise, yo uhave to see him in workouts.
the surgery is a good thing though. The other guys seem to have recovered fine, and it really was his main problem, now that the wrists are helaed up. And it is for 1 year!
I am also not counting on all 3 to be healthy and productive. If you can get 2 solid arms, do it. Absulute worst case? Too many arms (and that is not a bad thing).
One of them (maine?) could slide into the pen. Or it frees you up to trade someone.
worst case? He goes down, you don’t have to pay the incentives, and end up with Murphy at 1B anyway.
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-4:33pm at 4:33 pm (UTC -4)
what’s w/ the 1 year cap?
What will someone steal Ike Davis from us?
The guy had a good season, absolutely. Maybe he’ll have another one next year, maybe he won’t.
Do you remember the last two Mets Prospects of the year? Murph and Evans. Is Ike that much better than them?
What’s wrong w/ stashing him in the minors for a couple of years? Plenty of teams do it when they have logjams.
I fully expect one of the SPers to get injured. That’s baseball and that’s why you have players in the Minors. Niese, Holt, or the Figgy/Dessens/Nieve are SP depth, unless you expect 2 or 3 of our starters to go down like this year.
Again, SP depth is great. I just don’t want to rely on Delgado to fix the hitting and push one of our SPers to the pen when they all are easily #3 or 4 pitchers.
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:40pm at 4:40 pm (UTC -4)
Don’t forget that Ike Davis can also play OF. He’s supposed to be a plus fielder at 1B but if his bat is ready and he is blocked for a year or two at 1B, he can still have value to the major league team.
In the meantime, it wouldn’t kill him to play a full season or more in the minors. And as you say, he could fall flat against better AAA pitching.
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-4:41pm at 4:41 pm (UTC -4)
so was Nick Evans
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:51pm at 4:51 pm (UTC -4)
Evans was never thought of to have the upside of Davis. And he was terribly rushed to the majors. Believe it or not, he is only a year older than Ike.
All the ups and downs and sitting on the Mets bench has probably shredded his confidence and rhythm.
trs86
9/17/2009-7:05pm at 7:05 pm (UTC -4)
That’s it, we are not relying on Delgado to FIX the hitting. I just don’t want to commit multiple years to a position that we have a POTENTIAL replacement at. Especially when that player is marginal or a risk himself.
If it was Fielder or AGonz? Sure. Nick Johnson, LaRoche and the current 1B crop? I don’t see any I want LONGterm.
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-4:35pm at 4:35 pm (UTC -4)
BTW, wasn’t the issue w/ Omar last year that he fixed the bullpen but not LF?
Did he somehow improve LF over the season?
wannybackstra
9/17/2009-4:36pm at 4:36 pm (UTC -4)
Maybe he could take the blindfold off of Angel Pagan!
CaseStreet
9/17/2009-4:40pm at 4:40 pm (UTC -4)
I’d be happy w/ a healthy season.
Kingman 26
9/17/2009-4:40pm at 4:40 pm (UTC -4)
Pagan might run the bases better WITH the blindfold.
metsfan4decades
9/17/2009-4:46pm at 4:46 pm (UTC -4)
LOL. Good one.
trs86
9/17/2009-7:07pm at 7:07 pm (UTC -4)
Nope, but did we make it any worse than 2008?
trs86
9/17/2009-6:58pm at 6:58 pm (UTC -4)
Why should we depend on any of those 3? I think you get two mid rotation starters and then make those 3 fight it out for 4 and 5.
CaseStreet
9/18/2009-12:40am at 12:40 am (UTC -4)
why waste money getting another mediocre pitcher when we have three of them and need to fill other holes, including a #2?
why be satisfied w/ the same lineup that we had going into the year?
Why be content with a question mark in LF and a Delgado coming off of surgery? Especially w/ Reyes and Beltran coming back from injuries as well.
No, we need to try to upgrade LF, anything is better than starting Pagan, Reed, etc. If you’re gonna do that might as well just make F-Mart the LFer.
I give two rats asses about Ike Davis or “blocking him”. If he happens to actually be the real deal, then we are in a position of strength to possibly make a mid-season trade or we can just let him further develop in AAA and make a trade in the off-season. We have a potential replacement for SP in Niese, doesn’t mean we should be afraid of signing a SPer to a multi-year deal. F-Mart is also supposed to be the real deal, yet we are all okay w/ trading him or bringing in someone on a multi-year contract. Why, because of one good season?
I like Delgado as a player and person, especially on a Hudson contract, but I wouldn’t want to rely on him to play a full season after coming back from hip surgery. Johnson, LaRoche and Branyan may not be All-Stars, but they are at least league average and likely will make more starts then Delgado.
CaseStreet
9/18/2009-12:48am at 12:48 am (UTC -4)
Since we’re in the mood of bringing back old timers, maybe Pedro will give the Mets a discount for one year. He’s looked good so far and is far removed from surgery. Other than Lackey, is there really any SP you want long term? Plus, we have a few potential replacements in Niese, Holt and maybe Familia that I wouldn’t want to block.
CaseStreet
9/18/2009-9:31am at 9:31 am (UTC -4)
So, Pedro and Delgado? Floyd’s available, too.