Mets fans’ heads are exploding now that the Yankees and Phillies have pounded their way into the World Series. I, however, won’t have trouble deciding who to root for:
The Yankees.
A few weeks ago I expressed the same intention and was dubbed the anti-Christ by one charming commentor and another questioned my Met blogging legitimacy. Knowing full well I’ll be in for a similar blog-flogging with this full-fledged declaration, I nonetheless intend to make my case.
First, even though it galls me no end, I feel I need to establish my Met fan bonafides.
I have been a Mets season ticket holder since 1984. I have not missed an opening day in that time. I keep score at every game I attend. My keychain pendant is a souvenir 1986 World Series medallion given fans Opening Day 1987. The side of my refrigerator is covered with magnetic Mets schedules, much to my wife’s chagrin. I have every Mets yearbook since…well, every yearbook, and every media guide since 1988. I have a Mets seat pillow (really, a pillow, not one of those flimsy foam cushions), a dozen or so fitted Mets caps (including one with the Chinese character for “Mets”), souvenir cups from nearly every season and a can of Mets grapefruit soda from Japan. I have ticket stubs from every playoff game the Mets have played in the last 25 years save two (don’t ask), and playoff tickets bought for playoff games never played (e.g. 1987). I also bought my Loge reserved seats from Shea.
I will match my Mets fandomness with anyone decrying my rooting for the Yankees.
Now that we have that out of the way, let’s get to the heart of the matter.
I am not just rooting for the Yankees this year. I root for them whenever they are not playing the Mets. I was even a season ticket holder at Yankee Stadium in the late 1980s and early 1990s, but had to give them up – I couldn’t afford seats at both Shea and Yankee Stadium. Obviously I chose the Mets.
How can I root for both the Mets and Yankees?
Let me answer a question with a question for all you Yankee haters.
Why is it necessary to HATE the Yankees in order to root for the Mets? To me, this is like hating apple pie to justify liking cherry pie – and I’m presented with that choice far more frequently than the half dozen times I root for the Mets over the Yankees. I don’t have to hate red in order to like blue, I don’t have to hate John Wayne westerns in order to like Clint Eastwood westerns, I don’t have to hate Windows to like Mac, I don’t to hate anything in order to like something else.
Here are some of the reasons I hear on why people hate the Yankees:
1. The Yankees buy championships. Yes, the Yankees are a rich organization. But the Mets’ payroll has been second only to the Yankees the last few years. Where did that spending get us? The Yankees have not won a World Series since 2000, so where did all that spending get them? No, you cannot win simply by buying talent. It helps, but you need more than money to be a winner. And it’s hard to yell they buy championships when the Mets spend nearly as much – just not as well.
But that’s besides the point. The core of the current Yankee dynasty is Derek Jeter, Jorge Posada, Andy Pettitte and Mariano Rivera, all home grown players, all there since 1996. The Mets don’t have a single player on its roster from its last NL pennant winner just nine years ago.
2. Yankee fans are arrogant/cocky. It’s called swagger. You remember swagger, Met fans, don’t you? The 1986 Mets? Hell, I was obnoxious that year. Fans of winning New York teams get to be obnoxious. It’s damned annoying when it’s not the team you’re rooting for, but all New York sports fans suffer from it and Yankee fans just seem to have a corner on it since they win more often. I can’t blame them, though. Shoe on the other foot, I’d be cocky, too.
3. The Yankees win too often. I also hear this from people rooting against Tiger Woods. This just baffles me. Since when is consistant high-level success something to root against? Accomplishment and winning at the highest level are reasons to admire, not hate. And using this logic, you’d hate the Mets if they won too often? Me, I’d risk it.
4. George Steinbrenner. I’m sorry, what position does he play? Oh, right, he doesn’t. Steinbrenner may be many things, but he wants to win and has done everything he can – good and bad – to make that happen. As a Met fan I find it hard not to want to the same attitude from the Wilpons.
So, to get back to the original question: Why do I root for the Yankees?
I am a baseball fan. The Yankees are baseball’s foremost, most storied and most winning franchise. The Yankees are baseball’s ambassador to the world. Everywhere I’ve traveled around the world I’ve seen kids wearing Yankee hats. American is synonymous with Yankee. A baseball fan who hates the Yankees is like a film buff hating Alfred Hitchcock, a literature fan hating Shakespeare, a nature lover hating the Grand Canyon.
Most of all, I’m a proud New Yorker, proud of my city and proud of its rich baseball heritage. My city has two baseball teams. I see no reason why I should not exult in the achievements of both since their objectives conflict only six days a year. That leaves me free to root for both the other 359.
The Yankees are inexorably entwined with being a baseball fan and a New Yorker. How one can claim to be a baseball fan and a New Yorker and at least have some grudging respect for what the Yankees mean to the sport and to this city.
Here’s what really baffles me: how a real baseball fan can also be a football fan. But perhaps that’s best left to either George Carlin or another post.
61 comments
CaseStreet
10/27/2009-3:42pm at 3:42 pm (UTC -4)
mrbaby, you are one twisted dude.
Were you a Yankee fan also? I’d assume so, since you had season tickets to both teams.
A Yankee and a Met fan? Do you scream “Yankees Suck” from one side and “Mets Suck” from the other?
Why do I hate the Yankees? Because I was born a Mets fan. Not because someone said I should be a Mets fan, I just always was. And as a Mets fan, I was also born with a hatred for the Yankees.
The Mets get no respect, not even from their own fans.
metsfan4decades
10/27/2009-5:11pm at 5:11 pm (UTC -4)
LOL – well said. Especially the last sentence.
metsfan4decades
10/27/2009-5:12pm at 5:12 pm (UTC -4)
I should have added though…
I’m going for the lesser of the two evils and to me that is the Phils losing.
Yankees in 4. Get it over with.
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:14pm at 5:14 pm (UTC -4)
ill be happy if either of the teams sweep cuz that means it will be quicker for the free agent signings to start
jaydh
10/27/2009-3:46pm at 3:46 pm (UTC -4)
For me, the yanks are the lesser of 2 evils. Sure most yankee fans are obnoxious, but I don’t hate their team. I respect a lot of their players. Meanwhile, the phillies have ridiculed us and complained about us. I cannot respect a guy like victorino or root for whoever he plays for. Maybe he is the sole reason I cannot stand the phillies.
When Pedro starts I will be rooting for him, but every other AB in this series I will be rooting for the yankees.
mattsmith
10/27/2009-4:16pm at 4:16 pm (UTC -4)
But if Vic was on your team, you’d love him.
jaydh
10/27/2009-4:22pm at 4:22 pm (UTC -4)
He acts like a baby, I dont think i would like that no matter what.
mattsmith
10/27/2009-5:14pm at 5:14 pm (UTC -4)
Jose Reyes acts like a baby, too.
It’s all perception.
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:15pm at 5:15 pm (UTC -4)
one mans celebrating is another fans showboating – lets get real
jaydh
10/27/2009-5:16pm at 5:16 pm (UTC -4)
I’ve never seen Reyes run in from shortstop to argue a pitch or complain to the umps at all. It’s not perception, i have a friend who is a redsox fan and he says the same thing.
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:20pm at 5:20 pm (UTC -4)
agreed jaydh reyes has fire in different aspects of the game – he doesntargue that his spark is with his glove and legs
stickguy
10/27/2009-6:02pm at 6:02 pm (UTC -4)
Reyes also isn’t a cheap shot artist and dirty player.
stickguy
10/27/2009-3:50pm at 3:50 pm (UTC -4)
I hate the yankees becasue, simply, they are the Yankees. I would hate them even if I wasn’t a Met fan (so no, I do not hate them because I think I have to to be a met fan).
But, I am would prefer they win over the phils this year.
also, my pet peeve, but while they were out of the yankee system in the mid 90s, Derek Jeter, Jorge Posada, Andy Pettitte and Mariano Rivera all, at this point, are high priced (in some cases overpaid, in typical yankee fashion) FAs. No different than A Rod, Teix, etc.
Heck, Petite even left the team, and only came back when it wass the only place he could be wildly overpaid!
wannybackstra
10/27/2009-3:52pm at 3:52 pm (UTC -4)
I love a well written and interesting article even if some of the content, i.e. owning Yankees season tickets, makes me feel nauseous.
An extra point for the Carlin reference. “I hope I’ll be safe at home!”
BTW, I’m rooting for the Yankees, despite the torture I will endure from my friends and colleagues if they win, because Jimmy Rollins is a “DB” and the Phillies are our current and direct adversary.
GravediggerHebner
10/27/2009-4:18pm at 4:18 pm (UTC -4)
I hate the DH. I consider it an abomination. The first DH ever in ML history was a Yankee. That pretty much sums up for me why I don’t embrace both NY teams, even though it is legal and I could if I chose. One uses a DH.
The aspect of your thesis I find most compelling is the “the Mets and Yankees are only really rivals for 6 days.” I agree with this strongly. The Yankees have yet to beat out the Mets for an NL East title, or NL pennant. Division and League opponents are much greater rivals in my opinion. The Mets and Yankees are much more truly rivals in off-field aspects than on-field competition. I feel similarly about inter-league regular season play as I do about the DH. Both should be abolished, but I realize both are likely here to stay.
The aspect I find least compelling is the “Hitchcock/Shakespeare/Grand Canyon” one. The Yankees are easily discernible as the best baseball team in history, just (cut them in half and) count the rings. How does one prove that Hitchcock is the best director, Shakespeare the best writer, the Grand Canyon the best natural formation? I believe all those other topics, and who or what is best in them, is much more subjective and open for debate.
Even if for the sake of discussion we assume those you mention are indeed “the best” why must I or someone else like them? Should I consult a list every day and see what is number 1 in any particular category, and then just automatically like it because others have deemed it the best? Do I have to prefer Seinfeld to Bakersfield PD because so many others do?
Overall, nice piece, I enjoyed reading it. As I have stated here before, I do love baseball but in order for me to watch and enjoy it, there has to be some possible happy ending.
I can watch a Royals-Red Sox game and quickly develop a rooting interest, whether it be I lived in Boston for many years and have an affinity for the Red Sox, or whether it be I like underdogs and would like to see the Royals defeat Goliath.
But a Phillies-Yankees World Series has no happy ending for me. I know they wear “NY” on their hats, but so what? Geography and coincidence of birth location do not solve all decisions for all people. Just ask all those people all over the world you see wearing Yankee hats.
CaseStreet
10/27/2009-4:26pm at 4:26 pm (UTC -4)
One of them will lose, so that’s a Happy Ending! Unless ur talking about another kind of happy ending, then I know a guy who knows a guy.
GravediggerHebner
10/27/2009-4:29pm at 4:29 pm (UTC -4)
On your first point, well yes but then it’s balanced out by the other team winning. If we could find a way for this WS to end with BOTH teams losing then there is my happy ending.
On your second point, I’ll be in touch. The more people we can get to Friendly’s for dinner with a Happy Ending the better.
rustyjr
10/27/2009-4:43pm at 4:43 pm (UTC -4)
MEE SO HORNY !!!! J/K in all serriousness we have to have at least the local ny guys from the writers staff have a get together wherther it is in ny or nj – hey promo u can come also lol
udontmesswthejohan
10/27/2009-4:23pm at 4:23 pm (UTC -4)
Sorry, I’m sure you are awful nice guy, but I don’t get it. I mean I see that you are a season ticket holder and collect a lot of memorabilia, but neither IMO proves that you are a die hard fan of the Mets. Yes, it is clear that you are indeed a baseball fan, but you need to pick one over the other. Your choice to get Mets season tickets over Yankees notwithstanding, it seems to me that you are still very much a Yankee fan at heart. CHOOSE A SIDE!!!
jaydh
10/27/2009-4:27pm at 4:27 pm (UTC -4)
Most old timers root for both NY teams. My grandfather and father are like that. They have a preference, but dont root against the other.
udontmesswthejohan
10/27/2009-4:28pm at 4:28 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t know about that. You’d be hard pressed to find a real Brooklyn Dodger fan root for the Yankees. I don’t think that is true at all.
jaydh
10/27/2009-4:31pm at 4:31 pm (UTC -4)
Not hard pressed at all. My dad and his father were Brooklyn fans, turned Mets fans, that still root for the yanks when the mets are not in the race. And my other grandfather, lifetime yankee fan, still roots for the mets and watches all their games.
udontmesswthejohan
10/27/2009-4:33pm at 4:33 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t get it. Not sure how you could be a Brooklyn Dodger fan and root for the Yankees after they beat them continuously in the WS. But hey, I guess everyone deals with things differently.
jaydh
10/27/2009-4:36pm at 4:36 pm (UTC -4)
They are Mets or Yankee fans first, and NY fans second.
udontmesswthejohan
10/27/2009-4:41pm at 4:41 pm (UTC -4)
Just beacuse someone is from NY doesn’t mean I have to like them. I hate plenty of people/orginizations in and around NY. Yankees foremost on that list.
metsfan4decades
10/27/2009-5:16pm at 5:16 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t agree with this at all. I, myself, don’t know any old time Brooklyn Dodger fans who will root for the Yankees. The handful I know hate them – my Dad being an example.
And as one poster already said, born a Met fan, born a Yankee hater – which pretty much describes me.
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:21pm at 5:21 pm (UTC -4)
that goes without saying its in our dna love mets – loathe yanks rinse lather repeat
udontmesswthejohan
10/27/2009-4:26pm at 4:26 pm (UTC -4)
Furthermore, I don’t believe I read the initial post that you alluded to, but I have to be honest, I’m not really sure why you are blogging for this site when it appears that your loyalties are so divided. If there were two other teams in NY would you also be fans of theirs?
I’m also a lifelong NY’er who, despite all it’s headaches and foibles, also loves this city, but the Yankees do not represent me. Never have, never will.
trs86
10/27/2009-5:25pm at 5:25 pm (UTC -4)
How does it seem that his loyalties are divided. It’s not hard to understand. He likes the Mets as his favorite team but also likes the Yankees because they are from NY and represent baseball all over the world.
Not my choice, but who are you to determine that he is not as much of a Mets fan as you are?
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:37pm at 5:37 pm (UTC -4)
i respect his choice but i’d feel so dirty though
udontmesswthejohan
10/28/2009-9:45am at 9:45 am (UTC -4)
Because they are diametric opposites in almost every facets. IMO, you can’t really root for both, it has to be one or the other. You can be ambivalent, but that is different that proactively rooting for the Yankees.
trs86
10/28/2009-9:58am at 9:58 am (UTC -4)
Maybe because I have some friends that actually explained it to me but they are NC State AND Carolina fans. They are from Raliegh so they want NC State to do well but the LOVE UNC.
udontmesswthejohan
10/27/2009-4:30pm at 4:30 pm (UTC -4)
Your piece was well written, I’ll give you that.
rustyjr
10/27/2009-4:41pm at 4:41 pm (UTC -4)
to quote Darth Vader Mr. Baby ” YOU ARE A SPY AND A TRAITOR !!! TAKE HIM AWAY !!!
phillies09
10/27/2009-5:04pm at 5:04 pm (UTC -4)
congratulations…I have new found respect for Mets fans. I’m finally aware that there is something way lower in New York
http://www.nleastchatter.com/philliesphandom/2009/10/27/this-just-in-new-york-is-classless/#comments
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:13pm at 5:13 pm (UTC -4)
do you guys have a post like rag in philly? btw phillies09 nothing personal to you – you seem to be even keeled rtional phillies fan but just like yanks/ braves in ’96 i have to opt out of rooting for either team – my heart is just not into it
phillies09
10/27/2009-5:25pm at 5:25 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t blame you at all…I’m surprised people are actually choosing sides to be honest
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:39pm at 5:39 pm (UTC -4)
agreed im sure you would feel the same way if it were pirates / mets for nlcs
phillies09
10/27/2009-5:43pm at 5:43 pm (UTC -4)
You know I tried to think about that with the obvious mets a given…but as for the other team its hazy. The pirates have just been so terrible that as a baseball fan I’d be excited to see them at a NLCS level.
For me the worst would be a Yankees-Mets world series, just because of what the Yankees are/have been doing to baseball
stickguy
10/27/2009-6:04pm at 6:04 pm (UTC -4)
it’s called the philly daily news.
metsfan4decades
10/27/2009-5:20pm at 5:20 pm (UTC -4)
It’s the NY Post. Not sure how familiar you are with that rag sheet..er paper, but what did you expect? NEW YORK Post. As a Philly fan, you probably just need to take it with a grain of salt.
And speaking of salt…not to rub it in wounds but I laughed when I read that and saw the Victorino picture. But hey, our season was over several months ago so we take our chuckles where we can find them until 2010 season starts…..
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:22pm at 5:22 pm (UTC -4)
he does have nice legs – maybe he will be the grand marshall at the village halloween parade – j/k phillies ’09
phillies09
10/27/2009-5:24pm at 5:24 pm (UTC -4)
hahaha come on your mets fans so I would expect that reaction about victorino (although no matter how much you explain why I’ll never understand).
rustyjr
10/27/2009-5:39pm at 5:39 pm (UTC -4)
lol
trs86
10/27/2009-5:30pm at 5:30 pm (UTC -4)
LOL, are you seriously offended by the post? If so you are insecure and would never survive in NY. They have said way worse things about their own team. Relax and stop worrying what NY thinks about you and go try and kick both of our asses in the same season.
phillies09
10/27/2009-5:40pm at 5:40 pm (UTC -4)
Not at all I just find humor in hypocrites…
trs86
10/27/2009-6:05pm at 6:05 pm (UTC -4)
Does not look like you have found humor or hypocrites?
phillies09
10/27/2009-7:59pm at 7:59 pm (UTC -4)
appreciate it guys
phillies09
10/27/2009-8:01pm at 8:01 pm (UTC -4)
wrong reply sorry
metsfan4decades
10/27/2009-5:26pm at 5:26 pm (UTC -4)
Nice piece – even though I can’t agree at all. I’m a life long Yankee hater but to me they are the lesser of two evils this year. Yankees in 4.
Hey – I’ve got that same medallion from opening day 1987. What could have been….
phillies09
10/27/2009-5:57pm at 5:57 pm (UTC -4)
million dollar question. is there anyway to get through NYC going north during rush hour (5-6pm ish). I’m heading to Mass. so I wouldn’t have to get back on 95 right away after the city…
The GWB and TZ bridge are just so brutal I was wondering if you New Yawkahs had any secrets
trs86
10/27/2009-6:06pm at 6:06 pm (UTC -4)
Take a train with your players. LOL. Sorry.
phillies09
10/27/2009-6:09pm at 6:09 pm (UTC -4)
hahaha. What’s so wrong with a train btw? what’s an alternative? bus? is that classier. there’s no way a plane is faster
trs86
10/27/2009-6:16pm at 6:16 pm (UTC -4)
I have no idea, I am sure there is an inside story.
GravediggerHebner
10/27/2009-6:08pm at 6:08 pm (UTC -4)
Go through Scranton. It will take longer but at least you’ll be moving.
phillies09
10/27/2009-6:14pm at 6:14 pm (UTC -4)
yea I thought about it but I have to stop in bristol RI and 84 doesnt get near it. I think im SOL
GravediggerHebner
10/27/2009-6:29pm at 6:29 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t commute regularly so I apologize in advance if this advice is naive, but I would say as you approach The City listen to 880 AM or 1010 AM for their traffic reports and then adjust on the fly using GPS or maps if the Cross Bronx is bad.
stickguy
10/27/2009-6:35pm at 6:35 pm (UTC -4)
depends where you are starting from. The turnpike to the GWB will be a mess, plus you then need the cross bronx, and the roads through lower westchester and Conn.
TZ almost has to be better.
Giong to mass, if you will end up taking 84 through Hartford to the mass pike, you can cut up 287 to the NY Thurway and pick up 84 by Newburgh, although right now, getting threw the Harriman tolls is also a mess.
Take the train.
phillies09
10/27/2009-8:02pm at 8:02 pm (UTC -4)
thanks guys appreciate it
ellispa
10/28/2009-9:54am at 9:54 am (UTC -4)
I’ve been a Mets fan since 1966. I was hooked that year by a typical Mets moment when I attended opening day and they came a hair’s breadth from winning the opening day game for the first time in their short history. In now familiar gut-wrenching fashion they went into the 9th with a lead but gave it up on a throwing error by the rookie, Cleon Jones. Sound like a familiar Met scenario? My fate was sealed, ironically. Thing is you don’t have a choice about love and hate. I love the Mets but I HATE the Yankees on their own merits. In the late ’60s, early ’70s the Mets were better but that Yankee arrogance personified by the clownish Phil Rizzuto who could never admit the Yankees ever did anything wrong, persisted nonetheless.
I find the difference between Met fans who hate the Y’s and those who tolerate/root for them is that if you grew up in NYC, like I did, you have been surrounded by Yankee fans 24/7/365 and their inane cries of “26 World Championships!!!!” when they can think of nothing else to say. Much easier to have an even keeled attitude towards the Y’s if you grew up in say, southern NJ, and moved to NYC as an adult.
By the way, as a baseball fan I have great admiration for the Yankees place in baseball history. It’s just this year’s / this generation’s Yankees I HATE. Nothing I can do about it.
I’m a NL phan. GO PHILS!!!
trs86
10/28/2009-10:00am at 10:00 am (UTC -4)
Welcome to TRDMB!