Hold on for this one if it is true it’s pure genius.
According to Ken Rosenthal
Sources: Bradley being discussed in 3-way deal
Calling the deal a long shot he said:
“The teams indeed have discussed the framework of such a deal, though not in direct fashion, according to major-league sources.
The Cubs spoke to the Mets about Bradley-for-Castillo, while the Mets spoke to the Jays about Bradley-for-Overbay, sources say.”
This would be a great move for the Mets. Then you sign one of the three guys like Polanco, Lopez or the overrated Odawg. Overbay had a very good season last year with an .838 OPS and has a career mark of .812. In my opinion he is what the Mets could HOPE that Murphy could eventually turn into. He is signed for only 2010 at 7 million.
57 comments
prismo
11/9/2009-7:30pm at 7:30 pm (UTC -4)
Overbay had an OPS of .905 versus righties last season, but was terrible in far fewer appearances against lefties. He’d be ideal for a very good platoon at first, but it wouldn’t make sense to do it with Murphy, who’s also better against righties.
trs86
11/9/2009-7:34pm at 7:34 pm (UTC -4)
I am not sure you take a guy with a .838 OPS and make him a platoon guy. However, you are right he was terrible against LHP last year in limited AB’s. But I can say this if the Mets trade for him they are not looking for him to platoon.
fongy2
11/9/2009-7:39pm at 7:39 pm (UTC -4)
Ryan Howard isn’t good against Lefties.
Thats why you have Righties and Switch hitters to surround
and protect a lefty
who struggles against
them.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-7:45pm at 7:45 pm (UTC -4)
And that is partly why the Phillies lost to the Yankees in the WS, because Chollie Manuel didn’t do that. Batting Utley & Howard back-to-back played right into Girardi’s hands.
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:06pm at 8:06 pm (UTC -4)
I’ll take 3 straight divisions,one series title
and a runner-up the next 3 seasons.
Would you?
Kingman 26
11/9/2009-8:07pm at 8:07 pm (UTC -4)
Yes please!
trs86
11/9/2009-8:10pm at 8:10 pm (UTC -4)
What’s your point?
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-8:10pm at 8:10 pm (UTC -4)
Yes, I was supporting your argument for “righties and switch hitters to surround and protect a lefty who struggles against lefties.”
Certainly didn’t mean for it to come across as bashing your Phils!
trs86
11/9/2009-8:25pm at 8:25 pm (UTC -4)
It’s bad when you are walking on eggshells talking about the Phillies on a Mets blog.
fongy2
11/9/2009-7:36pm at 7:36 pm (UTC -4)
Sounds very good to me , as
long as the Jays don’t back
out and we end up with an all-time cancer in crazy Milton!
b/t/w, although I like Murphy and think hes rec’d far too much criticism,he’ll never be Overbay. Close maybe, but Overbay is a potential gold
glover@1B.
Additionaly, it would be a great move to get rid of Castillo while we can.
And any of the above noted options would be better for us.
Add Scutaro to the list as well. THIS would really be a nice start to Omars re-tooling.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-7:43pm at 7:43 pm (UTC -4)
The fact that the Mets are even mentioned as part of a rumor is a nice surprise.
I am not among those that feels the Mets must rid themselves of Castillo, but I realize he has his limitations and if they can turn his 2 years/$12 mil remaining into 1/$7 I like that.
This is where the eyes versus the sabermetrics will have a strong battle though. Overbay, according to the infamous UZR/150, is a significantly worse 1B than Murphy. All we have to go on with Murphy is the very small sample of 2009 in which he produced a 7.6, while Overbay last year was -0.6 and his last 3 years (each a decline over the previous) average to 2.5 so by that dreaded metric Murphy is the superior 1B.
Overall, I like Murphy, but I won’t cry if he is pushed out of a job by “what he might become.”
wannybackstra
11/9/2009-8:54pm at 8:54 pm (UTC -4)
A year, or less, UZR is not the greatest way to judge a defender. So I would not conclude that Murphy is better than Overbay on that basis.
However, anectodally, I thought Murphy had good hands at 1B and decent enough range to believe (is this now a forbidden religious discussion?) that he may very well be.
And Overbay’s three season decline is probably not an anomaly. But his experience alone probably makes him the better 1B for next season.
All that said, the key to this would not be improving defensively at 1B. The key would be the ability to improve defensively at 2B. And for that reason Polanco would be the way to go.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-9:05pm at 9:05 pm (UTC -4)
Well said and agreed.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-7:52pm at 7:52 pm (UTC -4)
Also I have an open mind to be convinced in the other direction but my initial leaning on a replacement 2B from among the 3 mentioned above is to agree that ODAWG is overrated and leave him out there, and to covet Polanco on a hopefully shorter deal despite his being 5 years older over Lopez. Polanco strikes me as more consistent, Lopez seems prone to wild fluctuations in performance and mood.
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:07pm at 8:07 pm (UTC -4)
All are better players than Castillo right now and likely
next season.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-8:12pm at 8:12 pm (UTC -4)
Not arguing that, simply telling you which of the three I would prefer.
We can’t have all 3, can we?
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:14pm at 8:14 pm (UTC -4)
Gotcha!
My order would be….
1)Polanco
2)Scutaro
3)Loez
4)Hudson
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-8:22pm at 8:22 pm (UTC -4)
I hadn’t considered Scutaro, but now that you bring him up your order of preference is another thing we can agree on.
Scutaro will always have a special place in my heart because I happened to be watching his game winning HR off Mariano Rivera as an A a few years back. Not to mention he’s a former Metsie.
wannybackstra
11/9/2009-8:58pm at 8:58 pm (UTC -4)
I’m in agreement generally but unsure of 2-3. I could go either way on that. Scutaro has been just an average fielder at SS and 2B. Lopez has been below average at SS (but with a nice strong arm) and has played two seasons at 2B: one not so good and this past season in which he was very good.
Polanco started to have the look of a guy who was in decline at the plate. But perhaps a season under the big lights will perk him back up.
Kingman 26
11/9/2009-7:55pm at 7:55 pm (UTC -4)
This would indeed be a fine move.
If we wind up with Overbay for Castillo, even I might have to finally be pro-Hudson.
On the other hand, let me be the first—
Slappy gone, Overbay at first, and Murphy at second?
Hudson’s a paper tiger—let Murph see how he can handle 2B and spend the dough on pitching.
trs86
11/9/2009-8:07pm at 8:07 pm (UTC -4)
HMMMMMM. Nah Mets would bring in ODawg and then have to bring in The Tongue for the postseason.
Kingman 26
11/9/2009-8:10pm at 8:10 pm (UTC -4)
Ha!
Gotta admit though, all of those doubles and 12–15 HR would look a lot sharper at 2B…of course, there is also defense…
wannybackstra
11/9/2009-8:59pm at 8:59 pm (UTC -4)
Hard to believe with all the hype, but statistically Hudson has been bad at 2B for three straight seasons and getting worse.
trs86
11/9/2009-9:02pm at 9:02 pm (UTC -4)
And got benched for The Tongue. That alone is enough to warrant an end.
However, I did read on one of the sites that the Mets would be interested in Hudson now because he would be cheap as not as many teams would look at him. Funny how things change in a year.
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:09pm at 8:09 pm (UTC -4)
He can’t my friend.
The guys a friggin’
butcher @ 3B,he ain’t suddenly
gonna become even Jeff Kent @2B. Pitching and Defense,Sir!
trs86
11/9/2009-8:12pm at 8:12 pm (UTC -4)
The guy had very little time at any position in the minors. I don’t know if he could have gotten any better or not.
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:16pm at 8:16 pm (UTC -4)
I saw him! @3B
plenty 2yrs ago.
Again,I don’t state lightly
b/c I like him
BUT he was a friggin’ butcher!!!!!
trs86
11/9/2009-8:22pm at 8:22 pm (UTC -4)
I still think given proper time in the minors he could get better at a position other than 1B. I don’t think he will ever be great defensively at ANY position.
So I guess my point is a lot of guys are very bad in the field early in their minor league careers.
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:26pm at 8:26 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah but he wasn’t a teenager and you wanna wait?
Let him figure it out in Pittsburgh or San Diego.Someplace like that.
It ain’t gonna happen in NY.
That said,later fellas!
Big Steeeler game about to kick-off. Check back later. Hopefully they’ll be more .
trs86
11/9/2009-8:43pm at 8:43 pm (UTC -4)
True and you can read it tomorrow. I never felt he should have been up this year Fongy. He should have been down in AAA learning to play A) 2B, the only place his numbers will translate B) Multiple positions to become a utility man. He IMO will never stick as a starter at 1B.
Kingman 26
11/9/2009-8:12pm at 8:12 pm (UTC -4)
Probably correct.
Just thinking of ways to stretch resources.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-7:58pm at 7:58 pm (UTC -4)
As fun as it is to speculate, this quote from the article seems to throw some cold water on it:
“The three-team possibility, according to one source, has “some legs, but not much.” The Jays are opposed to the deal, one source says — perhaps because new GM Alex Anthopolous does not want a trade for Bradley to be his first major move.”
Kingman 26
11/9/2009-8:06pm at 8:06 pm (UTC -4)
Perhaps this blows up into a mega-deal, involving many Met youngsters and Roy H and other Jays (and Cubs?)?
Could Omar be laying the groundwork for us to trade away Slappy and a bunch of prospects, along with maybe Pelf and/or Murph for Overbay and Halladay?
Surely this thought is no sillier than most on Nov 9th…
trs86
11/9/2009-8:09pm at 8:09 pm (UTC -4)
I have thought as you know many times about a deal that brings us Overbay and Halladay. Not sure if Cubs can get involved.
Here is a question, why do the Jays have any interest in Bradley to start with? For DH?
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:11pm at 8:11 pm (UTC -4)
Up their teams
“crazy” factor?
Kingman 26
11/9/2009-8:11pm at 8:11 pm (UTC -4)
Maybe for SOME offense if they dump Overbay and/or Wells?
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:17pm at 8:17 pm (UTC -4)
Well,he certainly can be….
offensive.
trs86
11/9/2009-8:20pm at 8:20 pm (UTC -4)
I will tell you this there is only one trade that MIGHT make sense for Wells and that is Soriano. Otherwise they are both stuck.
I guess you are right about the power output but they are not going to compete anyway so why take a 1 year 7 million contract and turn it into 2/21? Unless the Cubs are paying for a lot of Bradley?
fongy2
11/9/2009-8:23pm at 8:23 pm (UTC -4)
NOw that is a very good one.
Maybe,either team should hire you.
trs86
11/9/2009-8:27pm at 8:27 pm (UTC -4)
I try Fongy I try.
If I get hired make it the Cubs. I hate Canada (and their socialized health care) and the Cubs have a bunch of impossible players that would be fun to try and dump.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-8:33pm at 8:33 pm (UTC -4)
“Don’t make me delete your comment for political content” said the guy without health insurance.
trs86
11/9/2009-8:44pm at 8:44 pm (UTC -4)
Hey, I did not make an anti-Obama Care comment. I can hate the Canadian system all I want, right? It’s NOWHERE near the same right?
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-9:10pm at 9:10 pm (UTC -4)
I didn’t mention Obama and his plan at all.
Gotcha!
As long as it’s just American politics that are forbidden, then by all means blast Canada.
I hate them because they don’t have any serious cash tied up in a military industrial complex, but I love them because I can say I’m from there when traveling abroad (or is that a-BROOD, eh?).
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-8:17pm at 8:17 pm (UTC -4)
I’ve probably been reading the same things you have, which seem to suggest the only reason it’s at all viable is to move Lind and his superior production (compared to Overbay) to 1B, then winding up with a still somewhat productive OF in Bradley.
Apparently the Jays have some kid on the way named Randy Ruiz who gums it all up though. I guess it’s do they think Ruiz is ready to give them what a healthy not-going-off Bradley might give them.
Mr North Jersey
11/9/2009-8:13pm at 8:13 pm (UTC -4)
We get rid of Castillo’s 2 years 12 million for Overbay’s 1 year 7 million?
We get a player that’s a year younger than Castillo?
We improve defensively at 1st?
Where is the downside again other than the bubble bursting on the oft chance of bringing in a Fielder via a trade?
trs86
11/9/2009-8:23pm at 8:23 pm (UTC -4)
There is none, which is why it can’t be true.
Mr North Jersey
11/9/2009-8:26pm at 8:26 pm (UTC -4)
…and there you have it.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-8:34pm at 8:34 pm (UTC -4)
It remains to be seen if this or some variation will actually happen, but I do believe that Omar will make some surprise announcement by the end of the winter meetings next month, something none of us proposed or predicted.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-8:40pm at 8:40 pm (UTC -4)
TRS,
Kudos. A quick check of sportspyder shows you to be the first Met specific blog to report this.
trs86
11/9/2009-8:45pm at 8:45 pm (UTC -4)
Hmmm, nice. Too bad it’s 8:00 pm.
GravediggerHebner
11/9/2009-9:18pm at 9:18 pm (UTC -4)
According to Ken Davidoff of Newsday:
“As a club, we have to slug more than this year,” Minaya said. Asked about going after the big-name free agents, Minaya said, “I Think you always have to explore – and in the past, I’ve always explored, at least – the availability of the better players. I think me going forward, if those guys are healthy, I still think we owe it to at least find out, if the better players are there, what is the possibility of acquiring these players?”
It’s early, and nothing he says there specifically precludes getting a front of the rotation starting pitcher, but I’m getting mildly concerned that this concentration on slugging seems to keep coming up.
Someone else mentioned this previously, but I’ll just have to hope that he’s being sly and leading the reporters astray. Yeah, right.
CaseStreet
11/10/2009-12:18am at 12:18 am (UTC -4)
I would very much like for this to happen, plus $7M is pretty cheap and replaces Castillo’s contract. Though, you’d have to get a 2nd baseman. Hello Lopez, Polanco. Say $6M. Still have ability to improve lf and pitching.
jaydh
11/10/2009-12:22am at 12:22 am (UTC -4)
This trade is not going to happen, it makes zero sense for toronto.
prismo
11/10/2009-4:35am at 4:35 am (UTC -4)
Could make sense depending on how much money the Cubs and Mets give them.
trs86
11/10/2009-7:46am at 7:46 am (UTC -4)
Great point. Say the Cubs chip in 6 million and Mets chip in 3 million. That brings Bradley’s contract down to 2/13 which is about the same as Castillo and is about the same per year as Overbay.
jaydh
11/10/2009-2:11pm at 2:11 pm (UTC -4)
Its about more than just money, its about adding a headcase and a rumored team cancer.
stickguy
11/10/2009-12:54am at 12:54 am (UTC -4)
it would be wonderful if this happened, so for that reason, I am not expecting it!
But, it gives me hope that Omar may actually try wheeling and dealing more this year. I guess he tried that with the JJ deal. Maybe this year he can add a few more (and they will work better!)
I am also glad that more of you are coming around and joining me on the dump castillo bandwagon, and realize that Hudson isnt the answer.
I prefer lopez over polonco. Poloncos numbers have really been trending the wrong way, and lopez is much younger, and better, has a lot of positional flexibility. And a great OBP too, with more power than Luis.
Odd that he used to steal quite a bit, and a few years back just seemed to stop running?
looks like a great 2 hole hitter, although I was hoping to move reyes down too!
throw in olivo and a new LF to the lineup (along, of course, with Overbay, since he started this thread, but I am happy to just move luis for anything).
If they did this, and made the big $ move for pitching, is this enough offense for everyone?
Reyes
Lopez
wright
beltran
overbay
francouer
LF – pagan/carter/?? (some lower priced option)
Olivo
Murphy on the bench or in AAA working on D?
pretty good pop up and down there. No soft touches either. Of course, shove Holliday in the 5 hole, and it gets even better!