Since 12:01 Thursday night, I’ve been maniac. I’m checking blogs, websites, listening to radio stations, calling up friends and listening to anybody with any information about the Mets.Â
At work, I found myself writing down possible line-ups and rotations. I was calling up other Met fans who, like me, were chopping at the bit for any action.Â
The one thing that we all have in common is the lack of excuses for not picking up free agents and making trades, there is plenty of that going around. I know it’s never too early to discuss things like this but this Friday was more significant than most for Met fans and I didn’t realize it until I drove  home from work.
This had been the first meaningful day of baseball for Met fans since June.Â
June. It’s hard to believe that the whole season went by without anything….anything except the Jeff Francoeur trade.Â
We endured bad games, heartache injuries, an empty stadium and even a nightmarish  World Series to get to Friday.  I will admit that I was a little more  disappointed than usual when I heard the Mets doing nothing yesterday except talking to some agents. I’m trying to keep a level head but I admit that I’m overanxious. I can’t help it.
I know something will happen, I know these trades and free agent moves take time and God knows I don’t want the Mets to make a mistake because they want to grab the back page for a day.  I just would like the Turkey to taste a little better on Thursday…or at least know there is something to look forward to after the New Year. Â
So before I begin to make my observations and comments on what the Mets seem to be doing, forgive me if I seem overzealous for any move.
It’s been a long time since this team mattered in the scheme of baseball.
35 comments
metsfan4decades
11/21/2009-12:08pm at 12:08 pm (UTC -4)
This 2009 horror of a season is almost a blessing (note: I said ‘almost’). I truly believe Omar and Co. is going to be more aggressive because of it.
I think if the guys had remained relatively healthy – with just a 15 day DL stint for a couple like Delgado and Beltran, and we once again feel short and finished say, 2nd…..Omar might have been convinced this off season the team only needed a bit more help to put them on top.
The season was such a loss, and question marks/holes were exposed across the board, that I really think Omar realizes he’s got no choice but to come out swinging this off season. Especially if he wants to retain his job….
trs86
11/21/2009-12:49pm at 12:49 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed.
gonzowill
11/21/2009-12:29pm at 12:29 pm (UTC -4)
But here’s a question, what if Omar has all the right intentions but is restricted by the Wilpons? We both know what this team needs, I’m sure he does as well, my issue is whether the Wilpons will allow Omar to make the moves the team needs.
metsfan4decades
11/21/2009-12:53pm at 12:53 pm (UTC -4)
Well, fair point about the Wilpons. We know the Mets are not going over budget to have to pay the luxury tax. I think they came with 10-12MIL last year.
Wilpon did say Omar would have what he needs to get it done this off season so I have to take that to mean at least they won’t be deliberately reducing payroll.
I’m sure Omar has all good intentions. I’m just not convinced he’s going to go in the right direction. Time will tell.
I don’t consider Omar to be the smartest GM at times, but also don’t think he’s the worst either.
fongy2
11/21/2009-1:17pm at 1:17 pm (UTC -4)
No, but he’s in the conversation!
I don’t at all consider this season a blessing in any way!
Maybe if FMart,Niese,Nieve&Evans
had stayed healthy and been regulars the whole
second half we’d have been able to better know exactly what we have in them. But even
that didn’t go right.
rustyjr
11/21/2009-1:54pm at 1:54 pm (UTC -4)
nieve was a wild card – he was more jose lima than glendon rusch – probably would have fell back to earth quickly
fongy2
11/21/2009-2:10pm at 2:10 pm (UTC -4)
Maybe but thats my point pal,we don’t know.
I’ll tell ya though,
he was a top-ten Astro prospect
a few yrs ago
and in
short spurts,i.e.relief, could
be very helpful.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-2:19pm at 2:19 pm (UTC -4)
I agree….I think Nieve is going to make this team as long man out of the pen and emergency starter.
I think Figgy STINKS and I very much hope Nieve earns the spot which Figgy might be being considered for.
CaseStreet
11/21/2009-3:32pm at 3:32 pm (UTC -4)
careful, there’s some hardcore figgy supporters out there who won’t like that.
Figgy did have an interesting year last year and he does strike out guys.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-3:36pm at 3:36 pm (UTC -4)
Personally I think he is an AAAA type.
Seems like his good games came against bad teams/teams who were out of it, and who could not wait for the game to be over.
I just think he is perfect for a situation like August/Sept 2009, when there is no hope, but I just don’t think he belongs on a winning team.
I sure will root hard for him if he is on the team though. I guess the best I could possibly see him being would be Darren Oliver circa 2006, which would not be bad at all.
GravediggerHebner
11/21/2009-3:34pm at 3:34 pm (UTC -4)
I agree completely that if we’re choosing between a cheap Figueroa or a cheap Nieve, I would also choose to give Nieve the opportunity.
But if my choice was, as it was framed the other day, a $9 mil Jason Marquis or a cheap Figgy, I choose Figgy.
Their career peripheral numbers are stunningly similar.
Marquis ERA 4.48
Figgy ERA 4.54
Marquis WHIP 1.42
Figgy WHIP 1.46
Marquis K/BB 1.50
Figgy K/BB 1.61
The difference could be as simple as, after struggling through 4 seasons Marquis wound up under the tutelage of Dave Duncan in St. Louis, whereas after struggling for 3 seasons Figgy wound up a Pirate.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-3:39pm at 3:39 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, but just as I found the Pagan/Hart debate strange, how can you compare the numbers of a guy who has been a starter for years with a guy who has been a career backup?
Seems like very much of an apples and oranges situation.
And Grave, DAMN the Knicks!!!
GravediggerHebner
11/21/2009-3:44pm at 3:44 pm (UTC -4)
I can’t dispute the perspective that the numbers are apples and oranges, I can only reiterate the point about Dave Duncan and opportunity.
Marquis was a 1st round pick, he was going to get more of a chance to succeed than 30th rounder Figgy.
Now as far as “it seems like his games were against bad teams/ out of it teams” I will dispute that with some facts in a separate, wider comment below.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-3:49pm at 3:49 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, but Figgy is 35–he has never been given a shot?
He has been through at least 4 or 5 MLB teams and has been unable to stick as a starter or a reliever, except for with the extraordinarily pitching-depleted Mets the last two years.
GravediggerHebner
11/21/2009-3:55pm at 3:55 pm (UTC -4)
I didn’t say he’d never been given a shot.
I compared Marquis and Figueroa, at similar crossroads in their careers. One went to Dave Duncan in ST. Louis, the other went to the Pirates.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-4:06pm at 4:06 pm (UTC -4)
“Marquis was a 1st round pick, he was going to get more of a chance to succeed than 30th rounder Figgy.”
This really is just not true at all….what constitutes being given a chance?
Going through at least 4 teams as a starter and a reliever and never sticking anywhere?
I agree, Duncan has worked miracles, and maybe could with Figgy too, but Figgy actually has been given at least five chances now, and he has yet to blossom and is with his fifth organization (at least) whereas Marquis, while being pretty mediocre overall to be sure, has at least been a starting pitcher for six years now.
fongy2
11/21/2009-2:52pm at 2:52 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed Brock, Figgy’s a nice story
but he is the definition of a AAAA
Pitcher. Nieve looks like he has pretty nasty stuff,…At least once
through the order.
Fans forget how many pretty good RPers
are guys who struggled for a few yrs
trying to figure out what they really
are. Starters,Relievers,short guys,
long men in the pen.
I often flip through(as I have for yrs) a current “Who’s who in Baseball”
and its amazing how many guys with
good stuff struggle for yrs only to
suddenly become decent MLB pitchers.
This is what we agreed upon a short
time ago with guys like Bell and Lindstrom. If they’re hard throwers,
you don’t give up on them.
Another case in point, Isringhausen.
Did any Met fan ever think that this
guy would become a very,very good
Short-man after busting out as a
Starter? Not sayin’ Nieve will be that
but he like Parnell have real live stuff and again, you don’t give up on
or give that away to quickly.
Of course, if you get back Doc Halladay, that’s another story
fongy2
11/21/2009-2:54pm at 2:54 pm (UTC -4)
Should have read “too quickly”
rustyjr
11/21/2009-3:13pm at 3:13 pm (UTC -4)
honestly we shouldnt have to be reliant of the figgys of the world – i like him and respect him but when you look at some of the half ass stop gaps weve empleyed in the last 5 years – dave williams, jerimi gonzalez, brandon knight jose lima – I mean that speaks volumes about our minor league depth at the pitching position
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-3:42pm at 3:42 pm (UTC -4)
How could you forget Pat Misch and Alay Soler?!
CaseStreet
11/21/2009-3:40pm at 3:40 pm (UTC -4)
The hot stove is fun in ways that only a Met fan can enjoy. It’s perpetual torture.
Lackey
Cameron
LaRoche
Barajas
Polanco – getting rid of Castillo w/o taking a bad contract or having to pay much of his salary will be Omar’s toughest job this year.
Santana-Lackey-Perez-Pelf-Maine (I doubt Omar would send Maine to the pen or acquire 2 pitchers)
Reyes-Polanco-Wright-Beltran-Cameron-LaRoche-Frenchy-Barajas
Have a great day everyone!
rustyjr
11/21/2009-3:52pm at 3:52 pm (UTC -4)
to paraphrase c3po – ” were Mets fans we were born to suffer!”
btw check out my new article – some juicy bits there
GravediggerHebner
11/21/2009-3:52pm at 3:52 pm (UTC -4)
Subjectively selected Nelson Figueroa game logs from 2009:
8/5 v St. Louis 4.1 relief IP, 4 H, 0 R, 5 K
8/25 v FL 5 starter IP, 4 H, 2 R, 1 ER, 2 K
8/30 v CHC 7 starter IP, 6 H, 1 R, 10 K
9/5 v CHC 6 starter IP, 7 H, 4 R, 8 K (not great but same team two starts in a row, not terrible 2nd effort)
9/22 v ATL 7 starter IP, 2 H, 2 R, 5 K
Are there some rotten stinker appearances that I’ve not included? Absolutely, as there are some good ones against teams like HOU or WAS that meet your criteria. But I don’t think all his good work was against disinterested parties. He’s mediocre, like so many other pitchers, but I personally would not go so far as STINKS in all caps. You have every right to do so of course.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-3:58pm at 3:58 pm (UTC -4)
How about 15 baserunners in 5.1 against the Phils on Sept 11?
And the 9/5 Cubs game you cite above works out to a 6.00 ERA and a 1.5 WHIP number.
I saw his shutout the last day of the year and the Aug 30 Cub game, and it seemed to me like both opponents those days were in an extreme hurry to get out of there.
Might I be wrong? Of course, and if he is a 2010 Met, and does well, I will be very happy and gladly accept reprimands.
But as I said above, the guy has had chances with at least 5 organizations–as a starter and a reliver–and has never come close to sticking anywhere.
GravediggerHebner
11/21/2009-4:06pm at 4:06 pm (UTC -4)
All I set out to do was dispel the myth that anything he did of quality was due solely to the indifference of the opponent and I am satisfied that I did so.
He is certainly not “the” answer for the Mets. As I stated above, I simply disagree that he is deserving of all caps STINKS but that sort of thing is subjective and if in your heartfelt opinion he STINKS I understand that I cannot change that opinion and will cease to try.
I hope the Mets have better options than him and I agreed above that I’d rather give an opportunity to Nieve who still bears something of a prospect tag, unlike 35 yo Nelson.
I am not a “Figgy lover” I just can’t bring myself to all cap STINK him, that’s all.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-4:20pm at 4:20 pm (UTC -4)
LOL! Sorry Grave, I won’t use all caps again….
CaseStreet
11/21/2009-4:15pm at 4:15 pm (UTC -4)
sometimes guys get a bad rap. I’m not saying its the case with Figgy, but there are certain players who carry a stigma.
Eg., Figgy is not a major league player because he hasn’t been one before.
IMO, he’s as good as Redding or Livan. Not much of a endorsement, but no reason why he couldn’t be a #5.
He seems to be a guy that strikes out lots of batters and doesn’t walk too many.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-4:31pm at 4:31 pm (UTC -4)
Sometimes guys get a bad rap because they suck….
CaseStreet
11/21/2009-4:40pm at 4:40 pm (UTC -4)
At least he doesn’t STINK. lol
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-4:47pm at 4:47 pm (UTC -4)
LOL!
(Oops, all caps….)
stickguy
11/21/2009-5:26pm at 5:26 pm (UTC -4)
It will be interesting to see if the FA market really is totally dead for the next 3 weeks (until after the non-tender and arb offer deadlines have passed). Why rush out now to sign someone, when (if the reports are true) there could be a glut of players in a few weeks? And like they teach you in Economics, when supply exceeds demand, prices go down!
Or teams will just end up signing each others nontenders.
That DIaz guy from the pirates (the catcher) already looks better than Santos!
trs86
11/21/2009-7:08pm at 7:08 pm (UTC -4)
Yes in my mind Figgy does STINK as a regular pitcher. I think his success is only as a #7 starter who can do well in brief stints but the league would catch on to after more than a few starts in a row.
Lets think about this. If Marquis only cost .5 million and hit the waiver wire would anyone pick him up? Uh yeah. If Figgy did the same would anyone pick him up? Oh yeah, he has many times and NO ONE wanted him other than the Mets. Even the time he pitched a baby fit about being sent back down and actively looked for anyone to take him as a FA no one wanted him and he went right back to the Mets. He is good for what he is and you need guys like him… in AAA.
GravediggerHebner
11/21/2009-8:19pm at 8:19 pm (UTC -4)
All fair and valid points, but I must return to the original issue which prompted this discussion, my statement the other day that if my choices were a $9 million Marquis or a barely above league minimum Figueroa, I would take Figueroa and use the $8.5 million elsewhere.
So compare them as hypothetical $500,000 waiver claims if you must, but in real life Marquis comes with a significantly higher price tag that I don’t think can be dismissed, and one that I don’t think is worth the difference.
Kingman was correct in assessing one point in my argument above. When I said that Marquis as a first round pick would therefore get “more” of a chance than thirtieth round pick Figueroa, that was as Kingman points out untrue. You got me on that one Kong.
Since I believe the statement that all Figgy’s good games came against bad or uncaring teams is also false, perhaps we have a falsehood tie of sorts and should put this topic to bed, saving our more informed arguments for more important subjects such as when a millenium actually ends.
Kingman 26
11/21/2009-8:55pm at 8:55 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed Grave!
You are probably right about the issue of Figgy’s good games, as I am probably biased against him.
The falsehood tie–I do like that concept.
trs86
11/21/2009-9:29pm at 9:29 pm (UTC -4)
You mean like the difference between Wolf and Lackey? You know the extra 10 million per year and the extra 4 years?