WEEI reporting 1 year deal with 2 million with a second year vested option. I personally don’t like it at all. 2 million here, 2 million there… they ALL count. That is 2 million LESS then they had before signing him so say they have 30 million to spend, that is now down to 28 for a player who’s output could likely be replicated by a guy making the minimum… oh yeah and by a player who might be able to play other positions, or even play SOLID SS (unlike Cora who can’t make the throw with his weak arm) or a player who we KNOW is healthy and not coming off 2 thumb surgeries.
Nov 30
Alex Cora coming back in 2010
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40 comments
stickguy
11/30/2009-1:43pm at 1:43 pm (UTC -4)
agree on this one. If you are paying 2 mill for a clubhouse presence and “leadership”, can Jerry (please?) and make him the manager.
given the circumstances, seems 1 mill would have been more than fair, since he may not have gotten any other guaranteed ML deals offered to him!
I don’t mind having him on the team as the BU MI (especially if they can upgrade at 2B), but it was a waste of money, and a minimum salary guy probably could out perform him.
stickguy
11/30/2009-1:56pm at 1:56 pm (UTC -4)
OK, let’s recap. Seems that they had these positions to fill (at minimum, not counting potential upgrades, these are the open spots:
1 SP
8th inning guy
BU MI
BU CI/OF
2nd catcher
LF
Basically replacing tatis/cora/sheff/livan/putz and Schnieder.
with Cora back, that leaves 5 spots open. ANd, IMO, 1 major opportunity (2 if you count another SP) to upgrade- 2B (yes, had to go there).
and the big needs are some more power, a solid and reliable mid-upper rotation SP, a solid back end pen guy, and better D at LF and 2B.
So, back to one of my older plans, freshly dusted off and tweaked.
- make the Cinci deal happen for Aroyo and Philips. Move Castillo to whichever sucker (err, team) that will take him, but don’t take something horrible like Bradley back
- Snag Shoppach if he becomes available, or Olivo if get cheap, for C, to give Thole some more AAA time. If they can’t, roll the dice with Thole.
- Find a RH bat for the bench that can play COF and 1B (3 B a huge bonus) respectably to help out Murphy (aka the tatis role). Tatis is of course an options, as Evans would have been if he remembered how to hit. Don’t know who is available though.
- Plug in LF. This, of course, is the tricky piece, but if Holliday has to scale back his demands, go for it.
- keep every other prospect to help develop the farm (I hope the cinci deal doesn’t include too many, given the salary relief).
So what’s this, 2 trades and a couple of FA signings? Jeff and Omar should be able to handle that.
and payroll should be doable, with maybe a 1 year bump to cover Arroyo.
A nice cherry on top though would be Sheets, if he is able to pitch by opening day, on a risk/reward deal.
stickguy
11/30/2009-1:58pm at 1:58 pm (UTC -4)
oh yeah, for my ramble above, as it relates to p’ing away money on cora, the more spare roles they can fill cheap (like an evans or Thole for 400K vs. a stiff vet for 2.5-5 mill) leaves that much more $$ to use to fill the big openings.
jaydh
11/30/2009-2:01pm at 2:01 pm (UTC -4)
I reallyhope the report is wrong in the dollar amount. $1mil plus incentives would be fine with me but guaranteeing 2mil is just stupid…so thats probably what it is.
saltygary
11/30/2009-2:11pm at 2:11 pm (UTC -4)
Got no problem with this. Any decent bench player is going to make this type of cash seeing the league min is 400k. There are a lot of spaces the Mets need to fill and this guy saved the Mets ass when Rey Rey went down. Plus he is the one of the few guys that just went out and played instead of looking like a sad sack like much of the rest of the roster.
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-2:20pm at 2:20 pm (UTC -4)
Rey Ordonez?
saltygary
11/30/2009-2:21pm at 2:21 pm (UTC -4)
LOL oops wrong guy…
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-2:30pm at 2:30 pm (UTC -4)
Thinking about better days… understood. The infield of Olerud/Zeile, Fonzi, Rey and Ventura sure could use their mitts.
metro
11/30/2009-2:14pm at 2:14 pm (UTC -4)
Cora, Santos, Tatis (most likely), Pagan…. looks kind of like a certain 70 win team some of us know….
trs86
11/30/2009-2:32pm at 2:32 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah because for sure those guys will be starting half or more of the games again. Oh wait that’s the bench. You know one that was one of the best in the NL last year. Find a bench in the NL that was as good as the one the Mets started out with last year.
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-2:38pm at 2:38 pm (UTC -4)
You can’t go into this season not expecting your backups to have to play frequently. Both middle infielders are walking wounded and there is no sure thing at 1B, C or LF yet.
trs86
11/30/2009-7:49pm at 7:49 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed, not my point. Who had a better bench coming into last season? Tatis and Cora are fine bench players when looking at what the rest of the league has for those spots.
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-2:15pm at 2:15 pm (UTC -4)
Last offseason I thought it was ridiculous to have paid Cora to do what any AAAA player could do for the minor league minimum.
He played very well at the beginning of the season and when Reyes was first injured. Then his mediocrity was exposed as he played way more frequently than he should have. In fairness, he was also playing with two bad digits.
I think you can easily get someone to purely play a backup role for the league minimum or close to it. I don’t think you can get someone who can start in the event Reyes or Slappy are injured for close to league minimum unless you have a major league ready prospect (which the Mets do not).
So afterall of this, I guess I have to be willing to believe Cora’s injuries derailed his play and that he will provide value if needed.
trs86
11/30/2009-2:33pm at 2:33 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed, maybe they really like his personality or perhaps Boston or others wanted him. Gotta remember that the Phillies were desperate enough to sign Wilson Valdez.
GravediggerHebner
11/30/2009-2:25pm at 2:25 pm (UTC -4)
If this is true, it’s an indication that they’ve learned nothing and that nothing has changed. It’s gonna be a long year if this indicator turns out to a true glimpe into this off season’s philosophy.
trs86
11/30/2009-2:35pm at 2:35 pm (UTC -4)
Oh and by the way, I am also or bringing back Tatis for his same money or slightly less. Go out and find me a guy that could produce that kind of over all stats, play 1B, 2B, SS, 3B, LF and RF and is willing to just that.
oleosmirf
11/30/2009-2:39pm at 2:39 pm (UTC -4)
I would like Tatis back as well…just hopefully he doesnt have to fill in that often b/c he like Santos, Cora, etc. will fall victim to overexposure
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-2:40pm at 2:40 pm (UTC -4)
When you say “can play…2B, SS…” what do you mean by that? Anyone can stand there for a few innings at a time like he did.
I have nothing against Tatis. But there are no shortage of capable utility players in MLB and I think that you’ve overstated his worth.
oleosmirf
11/30/2009-2:43pm at 2:43 pm (UTC -4)
how many guys out there (at his price range) can give you .275 8-10 HR and not be too much of a liability in the field.
he’s also a comfortable pinch hitter…
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-2:56pm at 2:56 pm (UTC -4)
Fernando’s career pinch hitting line:
.215 .281 .316
Though he did have a whopping .325 OBP as a pinch hitter last year.
oleosmirf
11/30/2009-2:57pm at 2:57 pm (UTC -4)
i stand corrected then…i only watched him in 2008 and beginning of last season. I couldnt watch the team end of last year…
trs86
11/30/2009-8:09pm at 8:09 pm (UTC -4)
Of course you leave out the fact that he had an .816 OPS as a sub last year or a his 2008 .300 .364 .533 .897 line.
Or we could look at the fact that fangraphs valued him at 7.1 million in 2008 and 6.9 million this season while he was paid about 1/4 of that.
Or we could use your favorite stat UZR/150 to show that even in limited innings at each spot he still finished at +3 1B, -1.6 2B, +7.4 3B, 0 SS, +17 LF, -64.9 (RF 2 innings but was 4.3 in RF for 290 innings in 2008).
Again, find me a guy who will play for 1.7 million and have that value at that many different positions.
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-9:04pm at 9:04 pm (UTC -4)
I responded to his point about pinch hitting. I didn’t intentionally leave out anything. Thanks for the implication, however.
And as far as his UZR/150 goes (Mr. UZR is flawed), I could care less what someone’s UZR is in a handful of innings at a position.
trs86
12/1/2009-7:23am at 7:23 am (UTC -4)
How about LF? Is that now a handful of innings? Or 1B now?
wannybackstra
12/1/2009-7:51am at 7:51 am (UTC -4)
2B and SS is what I took issue with, which is plan as day if you read my post.
trs86
12/1/2009-7:55am at 7:55 am (UTC -4)
He is not going to be a good 2B or SS, that is why we signed Alex Cora. LOL.
But that’s not the point. My point is that it is nice to have a guy who can even stand at all of those positions because most MLB players can’t or won’t even do that.
trs86
12/1/2009-7:26am at 7:26 am (UTC -4)
These numbers are as a sub last year.
he had an .816 OPS as a sub last year or a his 2008 .300 .364 .533 .897 line.”
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-3:19pm at 3:19 pm (UTC -4)
His 8-10 HRs came because he played so frequently. His .438 SLG% was about the same as many other utility guys like DeRosa, Barmes, Maicier Izturis, Lopez and Eric Hinske.
trs86
11/30/2009-7:51pm at 7:51 pm (UTC -4)
So those other guys can stand at 1b, 2B, SS, 3B, LF and RF? Will they also agree to come to the Mets for 1 year and less than 2 million?
wannybackstra
11/30/2009-9:05pm at 9:05 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t know. You’re the one who speaks with their agents.
trs86
12/1/2009-7:24am at 7:24 am (UTC -4)
Snappy snappy snappy. As always when you don’t have a clue attack the other guy.
wannybackstra
12/1/2009-7:56am at 7:56 am (UTC -4)
So you have a clue as to how much money Eric Hinske and Fernando Tatis will make next season?
All I said is that you’ve overstated Tatis’ worth with your assertion that he plays every position on the field and is so productive.
And for a guy who almost always bases his opinions on the prior season’s stats (and who purportedly does not buy into UZR), why do you go back two seasons for Tatis’s stats and pick what really looks like a fluke year when compared to the majority of his post 2000 work?
And I didn’t “attack” you. I just pointed out that you are the one who seems to have all the insight on player salaries.
trs86
12/1/2009-8:49am at 8:49 am (UTC -4)
I could base what Tatis will make based on what he made this year and last year right? Do you think the market will shift that much? If you can’t base it on that then what is the point? Why not say I think the Mets should get Halladay, Lackey and Holliday? In reality it’s because Halladay will cost 4 top prospects Lackey will cost 16-18M for 4-5 years and Holliday will be somewhere around 5-90. You have that same insight. It’s called common sense.
Also, how about we get the facts on ME straight as well? I have said over and over that I agree that for every position but 1B UZR/150 seems to be effective and is the best we have.
Finally, I used Tatis’s production this year and last year for my stats. You can go back to previous years if you want but I like to focus on the fact that he has been a very productive bench player for two years in a row.
Kingman 26
11/30/2009-3:31pm at 3:31 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, this move clearly signals it is all over for 2010 already.
Why bother paying attention?
Maybe they will move Wright to LF and Cora can play 162 games at third??
gipperpdx
11/30/2009-7:43pm at 7:43 pm (UTC -4)
This move does not inspire much confidence for the rest of the offseason!
trs86
11/30/2009-7:52pm at 7:52 pm (UTC -4)
Why?
I just don’t get it. Maybe cost a little too much but certainly won’t matter in the long run.
gipperpdx
11/30/2009-8:09pm at 8:09 pm (UTC -4)
Why? If the budget is indeed $30M, we just spent 7 percent of that wad….on Alex friggin Cora. WHY? $1M guaranteed plus incentives, i.e. 3 percent of that wad…okay, maybe.
We’ll see….I just don’t want to hear we missed out on somebody who actually would have a significant impact because his asking price was a couple million bucks beyond the budget.
trs86
11/30/2009-8:11pm at 8:11 pm (UTC -4)
So you think the Wilpons said OK Omar you have EXACTLY 30 million and after that you turn into a pumpkin? Lets say you paid him 1 million instead, does that make a huge difference? If the Wilpons actually said “Nope we can’t afford Lackey he cost 1 million too much” then they should sell the team anyway and there is no hope.
gipperpdx
11/30/2009-8:40pm at 8:40 pm (UTC -4)
I agree…and await the sale.
trs86
12/1/2009-7:25am at 7:25 am (UTC -4)
Thought you would. Now back to real life.