Kudos to ed price for breaking this one which was later confirmed by Ken Rosenthal. Ken suspects a Burnett type deal in the works.
-No deal yet but this news is defiantly heading in that direction. If this is true and coupled with the Phillies/Angels news about their competition for Halladay…Hello Pinero/Marquis/Garland =/
UPDATE
According to Jon Heyman’s sources, Lackey may have been offered 5/$85 mil from the Red Sox
35 comments
DNDJohan aka kistics
12/14/2009-1:22pm at 1:22 pm (UTC -4)
I thought the Mets were going to be VERY aggressive this off-season. RedSox are SUPER aggressive.
Now they can move Buchholz to SD for AGonz. That would be an awesome move on their part.
whataputz
12/14/2009-1:22pm at 1:22 pm (UTC -4)
If Lackey is indeed gone. The way I see it free agent pitchers now fall into two categories.
1. One time really good, but injured and risky (wang, bedard, sheets..etc)
2. Consistant, but not great (Marquis, Washburn, others qualify I’m sure)
3. Joel Peneiro (please don’t sign him, especially if he wants more than 2 years)
I’m willing to roll the dice on a 22 year old left fireballer, especially if the price is somewhat right.
oleosmirf
12/14/2009-1:27pm at 1:27 pm (UTC -4)
Red Sox or Yankees will overpay to get Chapman as well. No way Wilpon spends that kind of money on a prospect. He wont even spend money on our draft pics…
I say Bedard or Sheets on a 1 year deal and hope for the best…at least that way if they implode it only affects the current season…
DNDJohan aka kistics
12/14/2009-1:30pm at 1:30 pm (UTC -4)
I agree.
Omar needs to push hard for Halladay.
Sheets/Bedard will still be there after Halladay is gone.
whataputz
12/14/2009-1:37pm at 1:37 pm (UTC -4)
I’m trying to think of pitchers that could potentially be dealt that could qualify for what we are looking for. The only name I can think of is Roy Oswalt, and I have no clue about his availability.
stickguy
12/14/2009-1:57pm at 1:57 pm (UTC -4)
oswalt scares the willies out of me. Huge financial obligation, and seems to be breaking down. And certainly not what he used to be.
to answer your questions, just off the top of my head, harang and Arroyo have been mentioned in the past as pending salary dumps.
dirtysanchez
12/14/2009-1:51pm at 1:51 pm (UTC -4)
I think we will see Pinero and maybe Marquis if Lackey gets signed by the sox. After 2009, im sure the mets will balk at any pitcher that has major injury concerns, so that leaves sheets and bedard out in the cold. Mets still have Niese and Nieve and Omar is high on both of them. Im talking out of my arse at this point…i have no idea what is going on in Omars head.
oleosmirf
12/14/2009-2:01pm at 2:01 pm (UTC -4)
If Omar signs any pitcher that isnt a #1 or #2 SP to a multi year deal then he hasnt learned his lesson and I will be calling for his head immediately.
stickguy
12/14/2009-2:02pm at 2:02 pm (UTC -4)
damn dirty, what a buzz kill.
pinero and marquis? I would rather save the 20mill per for 3 years and just go with the current crop (neise, neive). Pretty mush as talented, and way cheaper!
I’ll take a shot at Garland for 2 years I guess. That shouldn’t hurt too bad.
add garland and say sheets (if he is going to be ready to start the season), and that is enough volume to cobble together a rotation IOM>
and it is looking more and more like the 2 ace crowd isn’t getting their wish. So go with the solid but unspectacular SP bolstered by a strong pen option.
johan/sheets/pelf/ollie/maine/neise/neive? That group, if it stays healthy (for the most part) can get you by.
Heck, it is probably better than the 2006 rotation, and way better and deeper than last year!
and if Maine and Sheets rebound off their surgery to have good years (yes, a big if, but certainly possible), potentially very strong.
oleosmirf
12/14/2009-2:17pm at 2:17 pm (UTC -4)
I wouldnt do Garland at 2 years. We need as much money available for 2011 as we can. Get me Sheets or Bedard on a 1 year deal and if they blow they blow their arm out in June there is no long term impact.
In fact I dont care which pitcher it is as long as its only 1 year.
Then in 2011 break the bank for your 2nd ace and maybe even a 3rd SP…
Reyes
Castillo
Beltran
Wright
Bay
Murphy
Francouer
Molina
That is a very strong lineup and with Havens, Davis, F-mart, Thole coming up in the next 2 years you can slot them in at 2B, 1B and RF. (the 4 weakest spots in the lineup)
GravediggerHebner
12/14/2009-2:00pm at 2:00 pm (UTC -4)
Assuming he doesn’t fail this physical, that’s bad news. If he fails it, he wasn’t going to help the Mets anyway.
The Mets did the Red Sox a favor by outbidding them (however little) on Bay, because it seems perhaps (my own speculation/opinion) that the Sox were very lukewarm to re-upping Bay. They wanted him completely on their terms and when that didn’t seem likely, the switched direction to the best available FA SP. Showing their savvy IMO.
Not that I am predicting nor hoping for such, but let’s go worst case scenario here. Lackey to Red Sox, Bay to Mariners. What does Omar do then? Throw crazy money and a prayer at Holliday just because he’s the last member of the ‘big three’ standing?
The fine folks here and elsewhere who have been putting forth non-big three related proposals to make the 2010 Mets contenders had better hope that Omar was paying attention and has it in him.
I’m not saying he doesn’t have it in him, I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt, but I think we can all admit it’s hard to look back over his Met tenure and see examples of it. LoDuca is probably the best example. Omar made FA offers to two catchers at that time, and when neither jumped on the offer Omar zagged and traded for Paulie. It wasn’t a big time move but it was unexpected as I recall and it helped for a couple years before LoDuca’s ego took over. So it’s not impossible, it has happened. I look forward to a trade or two that we have heard not a whiff of a rumor about so far. Omar, I’m rooting for ya!
stickguy
12/14/2009-2:06pm at 2:06 pm (UTC -4)
I think, if bay and lackey ore off the market, he will make a value offer for Holliday, and quickly move on to a “zag”
As one of the frequent wild scenerio guys, I like that! I felt that all 3 were likely to end up getting deals that were more than they probably should (the beatuy of the FA market), and that their should be interesting names available as slaary dumps (in some part).
I loved the arroyo/harang + philips idea. Heck, I would be happy as a clam to see an Arroyo+ his contract for a “B” prospect deal. Instant improvement, and no lnog-term albatross action.
there have to be some decent OF bats available for trade. And since Bay isn’t exactly a gold glove speedster, how much worse could a guy like Dye be for 1 year?
wannybackstra
12/14/2009-2:22pm at 2:22 pm (UTC -4)
If Lackey is off the market, I’d probably turn my attention to the trade market. A guy like Gil Meche might benefit greatly from a switch to the NL. However, I would also couple that type of acquisition with one of the low-risk high reward candidates led by Ben Sheets.
Meche is 14-6 with a 3.87 ERA in interleague games. He has a 1.28 WHIP a 2:1 K:BB ratio and has dominated NL hitters to a .236 .302 .384 line. Not sure of the nature of his injury this season, though.
John Smoltz is an interesting idea for the pen, by the way.
wannybackstra
12/14/2009-2:23pm at 2:23 pm (UTC -4)
Those numbers would easily slot into the Mets #2 role right now as we pray for Pelfrey and gang to get their acts together.
oleosmirf
12/14/2009-2:36pm at 2:36 pm (UTC -4)
2 years and 24 mil left on that contract…There are better options…
GravediggerHebner
12/14/2009-2:39pm at 2:39 pm (UTC -4)
Feel free to start listing them. I’ve been looking at some of the options, and IMO I don’t see a lot better. I will gladly learn that I’m wrong.
oleosmirf
12/14/2009-3:32pm at 3:32 pm (UTC -4)
anyone one of the other mediocre SP (as long as its only 1 year)
Garland or Sheets (1 year)
this team is most likely not making the playoffs anyway so we might as well not bother lying to ourselves and accept the fact it will take more than 1 season to get this team ready.
2010: build the lineup (Molina, Bay, Garko)
2011: buy the rotation (Halladay/Lee/Webb etc.)
GravediggerHebner
12/14/2009-2:50pm at 2:50 pm (UTC -4)
Stick touched on the Reds and the possibility of Harang or Arroyo.
Wanny mentions Meche.
What else can we think of?
None of the names I’m about to type are anywhere close to ideal, but they could be available via trade:
Tigers Jeremy Bonderman, $12.5 mil for 2010, turned 27 in October, oft injured;
Tigers Dontrelle Willis, $10 mil for 2010, will be 28 in January, has assorted physical and mental issues, hasn’t pitched well since 2006;
Tigers Nate Robertson, $10 mil for 2010, turned 32 in September, also hasn’t pitched well since 2006;
Tigers Justin Verlander, arb eligible made $3.675 mil last year, will be 27 in February, may become too expensive for Detroit. I wouldn’t trade him away, but they might get a good haul if they chose to;
The Tigers have 7 SP under contract for 2010 if they consider Max Scherzer a starter, and not including guys who like Zach Miner who is a swingman and French their hot rookie. That’s just Tigers. Combing other rosters, will be back.
stickguy
12/14/2009-2:55pm at 2:55 pm (UTC -4)
And to think, met fans rag on Omar as being a lousy GM. Just look at how bad the Tigers roster is. Compared to Det. and Tor., castillo and Ollie aren’t even a blip on the bad contract radar!
although I will say the Mets worst contract is probably K Rod, due to the 4th year at something like 17mill. Gotta factor that in if you start backloading other contracts.
CaseStreet
12/14/2009-2:57pm at 2:57 pm (UTC -4)
Mets could be long shots on Lowe or Vazquez if we get a third team like the Cubs to include a RH Bat for the Braves.
stickguy
12/14/2009-2:50pm at 2:50 pm (UTC -4)
Well, looks like the Mets did make an offer to an Angels FA pitcher after all! Just not the big money one…
“The Mets offered a minor league deal to pitcher Kelvim Escobar, reports Efrain Zavarce for Venezuelan newspaper El Nacional”
I actually like this deal (if it goes through). No risk, and if he is finally able to stay healthy, another viable 8th inning option.
Him and that everts guy? Nice value signings, and who knows, maybe they can put together a solid pen on the cheap (saving money for other uses)? ALthough Capps would be a nice option if they want to spend a few $$s.
GravediggerHebner
12/14/2009-2:59pm at 2:59 pm (UTC -4)
I like it but as you note, he’s a bullpen guy. I read that his agent was looking for a one year incentive deal and a bullpen job for Kelvim to re-establish his health and worth and then hit the FA market again next fall, I’d be happy to have the Mets give him that opportunity.
I’m going to guess that Capps will have multiple opportunities to close elsewhere and probably choose from among those. I could be wrong.
stickguy
12/14/2009-3:08pm at 3:08 pm (UTC -4)
they had capps on XM earlier. Afterward, the hosts speculated that he may take a 1 year deal with a contendor (no Met cracks please) as a set up guy and look to have a big year and cash in next off season, if he didn’t get any great offers now.
steveo
12/14/2009-2:53pm at 2:53 pm (UTC -4)
Halliday is now taking a physical for the phillies
steveo
12/14/2009-2:55pm at 2:55 pm (UTC -4)
According to xm phillies talking to halladays agent about extension
DNDJohan aka kistics
12/14/2009-3:01pm at 3:01 pm (UTC -4)
That’s Doc Halladay… right???
stickguy
12/14/2009-3:04pm at 3:04 pm (UTC -4)
also speculation that they will trade lee to get prospects and free up the payroll needed to sign Doc.
given how well Lee pitched, if they really do trade him to bring in halladay, that is pretty much a wash.
I would just stretch the payroll (reinvest all those post season $$s) and make a huge run at it this year, then let Lee walk and take the picks.
Oh, and as a Met fan, hope that Halladay blows out his arm in ST!
wannybackstra
12/14/2009-3:14pm at 3:14 pm (UTC -4)
For long-term value, I might favor Lee over Halladay if I’m Philly. For one thing, he’s already proven that pitching in front of a bunch of a$$holes won’t phase him. He’s younger. And his extension would have to have an annual salary lower than Doc’s.
GravediggerHebner
12/14/2009-2:57pm at 2:57 pm (UTC -4)
I suppose it’s possible that the Cubs might be tired of Carlos Zambrano’s act, and if they can’t trade Bradley they may look for salary relief another way, but with his contract
# 10:$17.875M, 11:$17.875M, 12:$18M, 13:$19.25M vesting player option
# full no-trade clause
the Mets might as well just go all in on Halladay instead.
stickguy
12/14/2009-2:58pm at 2:58 pm (UTC -4)
hebs, add Lowe to the list (not likely an option for the Mets, but he is certainly available!). And I suppose you could still twist the giant’s FO arm and get zito if you really wanted him!
Oh, and if the Phils do get Halladay, you can add blanton to the list.
Josh johnson if you want to unload a serious prospect package.
Oswalt finally?
dirtysanchez
12/14/2009-3:04pm at 3:04 pm (UTC -4)
Would love to have JJ (even if just not to face him anymore) but no way are the marlins giving him up. Oswalt is always a possiblity but the Astros dont seem inclined to move him…ever. If philly gets Halladay and retains Lee, its over. A three man set of Halladay,Lee,Hamels is pretty difficult to overcome,
GravediggerHebner
12/14/2009-3:13pm at 3:13 pm (UTC -4)
OK so the “possibly available via trade” list of starters (of various levels of worth, ability & likelihood) is roughly:
Harang
Arroyo
Meche
Lowe
Vazquez
Blanton
J. Johnson
Bonderman
Willis
Robertson
Verlander
C. Zambrano
I think a couple are really not very likely and a couple are fairly useless. I hope Omar is aware of some more that we are just not thinking of.
wannybackstra
12/14/2009-3:19pm at 3:19 pm (UTC -4)
Thanks for putting together the list of considerations.
Would the Mets have the bullets in the chamber to pull in Johnson or Verlander, two young powerhouses in their primes? Of course, they’d be the most favorable.
I’d like either Vazquez or Lowe, in that order. And rank them as the second tier guys behing Johnson and Verlander. Zambrano has the talent to be in this group or the above but his contract is just ridiculous and would be prohibitive especially relative to his performance and value.
Blanton, Meche, Harang and Arroyo are in the third tier of this conversation.
Wouldn’t touch the rest given their various health/performance issues.
GravediggerHebner
12/14/2009-3:23pm at 3:23 pm (UTC -4)
I agree with your entire comment and it’s tiers.
The only reason I even bothered to include “the rest” is because given their contracts and their injury/poor performance situations, they would seemingly be available. But acquiring any of them would be a gigantic act of faith.
gipperpdx
12/14/2009-6:30pm at 6:30 pm (UTC -4)
Well…This day sucks.
Is Omar even trying anymore…or is he working on his resume for his foreordained June firing?