At Metsmerizedonline Mikey J’s outlook luckily has dramatically changed now that Jason Bay is with New York.
“I was ready to chalk up the 2010 season to rebuilding and maybe finishing in fourth place, but Minaya’s pursuit and subsequent landing of Bay to play left field for the Mets and possibly bat cleanup has changed my outlook of this team.”
Gregg Hopps of Seven Train To Shea thinks that Wilpons can learn something about winning if they can just, go to a Starbucks with a Giant?
“Maybe the Wilpons should have some coffee and learn from John Mara.”
Finally in what can only be described as “B-I-T-T-E-R” Bill Price of The Bitter Bill had this to say regarding why Roberto Alomar didn’t make the Hall Of Fame.
“You have to figure had he even played halfway decent with the Mets, he would be a Hall of Famer right now. Still, since we all had to suffer through his two years, I’m glad he’s paying for it, too.”
34 comments
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-7:58am at 7:58 am (UTC -4)
Man, Bill really is bitter.
Anyway, if the Mets can’t improve the starting pitching significantly, they should focus on improving the bullpen more with several free agents still available including Valverde, Gregg, Bradford, Shouse, Calero, etc.
trs86
1/7/2010-8:53am at 8:53 am (UTC -4)
The question is how many more spots do they have? You and I can go back and forth on the merit of each one but that is not really useful as we both know there are some names that are set.
Krod, Escobar, Ryota Igarashi, Feliciano, Parnell, and I would say Stokes is also a lock. Thus in my opinion we have 1 spot at most that I would guess would go to a guy like Nieve or Misch. In other words I think we are done. Not to mention we have a guys like Everts and Green too.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-8:57am at 8:57 am (UTC -4)
I think Parnell is far from a lock. He wasn’t any good last year and still has options. He’s got a lot of work to do on his secondary pitches and commanding his powerful but erratic fastball.
And I don’t think Stokes is a lock either. He doesn’t make enough money to be a lock and he doesn’t pitch well enough to be a lock.
trs86
1/7/2010-8:58am at 8:58 am (UTC -4)
Wanny again, you and I can go back and forth on their merits but I don’t think the Mets will.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-9:01am at 9:01 am (UTC -4)
If you don’t want to discuss it, then why did you bring it up?
I don’t know what the Mets will do. I just don’t see why the decision would already be made to keep marginal guys in the bullpen.
trs86
1/7/2010-9:04am at 9:04 am (UTC -4)
I agree. I am fine with discussing their merits but I truly don’t think it will matter because in my mind the Mets are not going to get rid of Stokes who pitched 70 innings of under 4.00 ERA relief last year or Parnell who they still seem to have a soft spot for.
trs86
1/7/2010-9:08am at 9:08 am (UTC -4)
We are talking about 120+ innings of what many would consider effective relief for less .9 million.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-9:14am at 9:14 am (UTC -4)
And I’m talking about bringing in a guy to serve a higher leverage role than what Stokes is capable to do.
I’m talking about bringing in guys to pitch key situations in the late innings, something Stokes failed at when given the chance and is not equipped to do as a glorified ROOGY.
trs86
1/7/2010-9:31am at 9:31 am (UTC -4)
Looking at the stats below he did fine (in key situations in the late innings).
trs86
1/7/2010-9:02am at 9:02 am (UTC -4)
I think the Mets will see Parnell’s 3.46 ERA as a reliever and cheap price as a lock.
Stokes I think they like his fastball and his under 4 ERA in 100 innings as a reliever the last 2 years as a cheap positive as well.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-9:12am at 9:12 am (UTC -4)
And who is the guy they are confident in to handle the 8th inning duties as Putz was supposed to do last year? Surely they are not counting on Igarashi, who has never faced major league hitters, or Escobar who didn’t pitch at all for two
years?
Or did they change strategy on this former priority?
If Parnell has a bad Spring Training, you think they are going to keep him around just because he’s cheap? He’s got a lot to work on still.
I can’t get inside their heads to know for whom they hold soft spots but I can’t imagine they won’t prioritize performance over everything, especially with a young kid with still so much to learn.
Regarding Stokes, they may not be mislead by his ERA the last two seasons. The guy can’t get Oprah Winfrey out if she stood at the left side of the plate and then he failed miserably when his role increased in importance late in the season. He doesn’t make enough money to dictate his place on the team.
trs86
1/7/2010-9:30am at 9:30 am (UTC -4)
Stokes numbers:
.229 BAA RISP
.246 BAA Men On
.213 BA Late and Close
with in 1 and with in 2 runs were his best in that category.
.235 High leverage
.609 OPS in 7th inning (his normal role)
Pitched on 0 rest 19 games and had a .180 BAA in those.
2.00 ERA Braves
0.00 ERA Marlins
2.25 ERA Phills
4.05 ERA Nats
Obviously those numbers are based on limited sample but for last year that’s what we got.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-9:34am at 9:34 am (UTC -4)
You left out his numbers v. lefties and his September (or was it August?) when his role was promoted to the de facto 8th inning guy.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-9:38am at 9:38 am (UTC -4)
You also left out his paltry K total of 45 in 70 IP and 38 walks to go with it.
And in September when he was elevated to set up guy he managed an 8.18 ERA. In fact, he was only good for about half the season (April, July and August). In each of the other months his ERAs were north of six.
Hardly a model for consistency and reliability.
Lefties hit .330 against him.
You want this guy in your late inning equation?
trs86
1/7/2010-9:42am at 9:42 am (UTC -4)
Fact is Wanny that even with those numbers his BAA with RISP, Men On, Late and Close, High Leverage were all still good.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-9:50am at 9:50 am (UTC -4)
But not when he was elevated to the role that we have no other obvious person to fill.
And how likely are those peripherals to stay the same if he doesn’t strike anyone out, plays in front of a relatively mediocre defense and can’t get a lefty out if his life depended on it?
The stats you cited might be good in aggregate but it does us little good if for three months he stinks and then makes up for it with two really good months. And it does us no good if he can manage to strand runners in the sixth but not the 8th when he is the primary set up guy.
You want to keep Stokes around as a long man or a 6th-7th type guy? That’s fine. But someone has to pitch the 7th and 8th innings and other than Feliciano I don’t see who we can have confidence in.
trs86
1/7/2010-9:52am at 9:52 am (UTC -4)
Not saying I want him as an 8th inning guy. I think he is fine for the pen in his role. He performed well enough as the 7th inning.
As for September, we also have to remember the guy MIGHT have just gotten tired. Going from 30+ innings the year before to 70+ innings is a change.
But lets look at September a little.
He gave up 10 runs in 12.2 innings appearing in 14 games. That’s bad. But if you allow me to cherry pick a little he gave up half of those runs in 2 appearances for a total of 1 inning. If you take those out (allowing me to cherry pick) then the numbers return to about what he had done all year.
But you are right, September was no matter how you look at it was not a good month for him. The Mets job will be to determine if it was because he was tired or because he is not any good. I will say this, in August he pitched in 16 games and was pitching in the 8th inning or later in all but one of them and produced a .208 BAA and a 3.07 ERA.
trs86
1/7/2010-9:32am at 9:32 am (UTC -4)
Anyway, are their any of those names that you would be more sure of as a setup guy relative to the cost? I am guessing right now it’s an open competition for setup but in my opinion I don’t see any more big names being brought in. However, we can both hope Parnell is traded to make the team better and open up a spot in the process.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-9:38am at 9:38 am (UTC -4)
I find it pretty comical that today you find it irrational to try to improve the bullpen because of Brian Stokes and Bobby Parnell after yesterday when you advocating signing Orlando Hudson with Luis Castillo still here.
trs86
1/7/2010-9:57am at 9:57 am (UTC -4)
Not sure what that has to do with it. I am not saying that I (repeat I) would not bring in another guy. Just saying that I don’t think the Mets will. Just as some of you said yesterday that there is no way they bring in Hudson with the position blocked I was saying I would. Never implied I thought the Mets would.
Mr North Jersey
1/7/2010-10:09am at 10:09 am (UTC -4)
trs86
1/7/2010-10:10am at 10:10 am (UTC -4)
I, that is I, completely agree that I would sign Chapman as well if I were in the position to carry out what I wanted to do.
Mr North Jersey
1/7/2010-10:13am at 10:13 am (UTC -4)
trs86
1/7/2010-9:55am at 9:55 am (UTC -4)
Starting back down here: I agree Stokes nor Parnell are the answer for setup man. I think the Mets are depending on Escobar or Igarashi to pair with Feliciano. If both of them stink and Stokes or Parnell can’t step-up either I could see them trading for a guy. I just don’t see them bumping one of them to bring in another guy.
CaseStreet
1/7/2010-10:08am at 10:08 am (UTC -4)
well, if they really were able to find a SU guy and needed to make room for him, couldn’t they send Parnell down to AAA. He may even learn to throw an off-speed pitch.
trs86
1/7/2010-10:09am at 10:09 am (UTC -4)
Yes they could. I just don’t see them doing it. If they do it will be as a starter and he would in my opinion become plain trade bait.
trs86
1/7/2010-10:09am at 10:09 am (UTC -4)
What is more unusual with Stokes is how Manuel kept throwing him out there against LH. The guy is as close to a ROOGY as you can get but still ended up facing almost as many LH as RH. If they treated this guy like Bradford who for the Mets had almost 3 times as man PA against a RH then his numbers would look MUCH better. I am not a big fan of OOGY’s but if you got one you should use him correctly.
wannybackstra
1/7/2010-10:36am at 10:36 am (UTC -4)
Don’t get me started on Manuel….
fongy2
1/7/2010-10:37am at 10:37 am (UTC -4)
I’d like us to sign Dotel
or even Calero BUT don’t
think we will.
I think Omar is about done
with the Pen.
I’m in agreement about Parnell.
He was outstanding until about
the middle of June,then got hammered much of the next month
as Jerry was well over using
the kid.
Once he went into the rotation
it got worse.
Like with Murphy, I think the full yr in the Majors will be
beneficial THIS season.
Now I don’t know if this kid can Pitch the 8th but think
he’ll be pretty good as a middle inning guy until he learns to mix in an off-speed
pitch.
trs86
1/7/2010-10:41am at 10:41 am (UTC -4)
I think that if the 2 newbies can’t handle the 8th inning spot then it will go back to Feliciano and committee.
fongy2
1/7/2010-10:43am at 10:43 am (UTC -4)
I’m hoping Omar’s right
about Escobar.
Those things never seem
to go our way
BUT Omar has talked about
the guy like
he knows something we don’t.
trs86
1/7/2010-11:03am at 11:03 am (UTC -4)
Actually those types of moves are the one Omar is usually good at. Low risk, high reward. It’s a guy like Pedro or Putz that backfires on performance.
fongy2
1/7/2010-11:13am at 11:13 am (UTC -4)
I was talking more about getting aging players coming off serious injuries.
GravediggerHebner
1/7/2010-11:46am at 11:46 am (UTC -4)
Mr. NJ I really like this feature, it’s nice to have access to these stories from “home base” and I love that graphic, as always stellar work bro.