Personally I would go with
K-Rod
Igarashi
Calero
Nieve
Figgy
Feliciano
Takahashi to open the season.
Green and Parnell have options and neither are good enough (at this point) that I would want to lose Figgy/Nieve just to carry them. This Would allow the Mets to hold onto both Nieve and Figgy, Parnell to get more time to work on his cutter in the minors and get a longer look at Nieve, Figgy and Takahashi without losing talent. Personally I think Niese will be/should be the #5 but should he falter (or should Perez/Maine/Pelfrey do the same) it would be nice to still have Figgy to fill in there.
103 comments
CaseStreet
3/17/2010-12:12pm at 12:12 pm (UTC -4)
Pretty much agree, but be careful not to give Figgy too much praise around here.
Still, there’s much time left to make these decisions.
saltygary
3/17/2010-12:16pm at 12:16 pm (UTC -4)
Ya now I’ve had this feeling that you may actually be Figgy in disguise.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:14pm at 12:14 pm (UTC -4)
Krod, Feliciano, Iggy, Calero, Nieve, Misch, Green.
Also, I thought it was determined that Green did NOT have options remaining?
metro
3/17/2010-12:17pm at 12:17 pm (UTC -4)
Per Adam Rubin-Among the 40-man roster people who do have at least one option remaining: Tobi Stoner, Clint Everts, Jon Niese, Sean Green, Bobby Parnell, Eddie Kunz, Jay Marshall, Arturo Lopez, Chris Coste, Omir Santos, Josh Thole, Daniel Murphy, Nick Evans, Shawn Bowman, Angel Pagan, Fernando Martinez, Jason Pridie, Chris Carter.
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/mets/2010/02/four-mets-out-of-minor-league.html#ixzz0iS2ftYEx
trs86
3/17/2010-12:18pm at 12:18 pm (UTC -4)
Hmmm, interesting. It was reported last year at this time when the Mets let O’Day go back that Green did not have any options.
saltygary
3/17/2010-12:16pm at 12:16 pm (UTC -4)
Nieve can go on his merry way for all I care…
Parnell needs to stay with the club. He has done everything the team asked him to do and deserves the chance to prove that he can stay in the pen.
For 5th starter I would like to see Figgy or Tak. Put Niese in Buffalo and give him the time to come back from his injuries and work on his addl pitches.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:17pm at 12:17 pm (UTC -4)
Hasn’t Nieve done everything the team has asked him to do and deserves the chance to prove he can stick?
Nieve was just as highly touted as Parnell and has had similar success. No reason to lose either.
metro
3/17/2010-12:19pm at 12:19 pm (UTC -4)
Well your point is essentially what my thought process is. Parnell was mediocre at best last year (1.50 whip as a reliever) is working on a new pitch because they thought he needed one and the key HAS OPTIONS LEFT, why lose Nieve or Figgy when we don’t have to? I’d rather keep all 4.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:21pm at 12:21 pm (UTC -4)
But then in your plan we lose Misch who has put up better numbers than Figgy in the pen and very comparable numbers in the SR while also being LH and much younger.
metro
3/17/2010-12:23pm at 12:23 pm (UTC -4)
“Problem” with Misch is that the Mets apparently ONLY see him as a starter (I forget if it was Omar or Manuel who said it) so it limits his value to the team. If he’s not the #5 starter AND they don’t see him as a reliever then what does he add?
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:25pm at 12:25 pm (UTC -4)
He’s been pitched as a reliever this Spring and performed very well in the pen last year.
Misch over Figgy in a heartbeat.
metro
3/17/2010-12:30pm at 12:30 pm (UTC -4)
The issue with Misch is his numbers vs. lefties stink so his value would be as a long reliever. He also didn’t “perform very well” in the pen last year… 4.09 era 1.69 whip
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:37pm at 12:37 pm (UTC -4)
His career splits v. lefties is about exactly the same as vs. righties: 286 .340 .458 v. lefty and 284 .342 .454 v. righties.
As a reliever his career WHIP is 1.267 and batters hit only 255 .316 .368 against him. His ERA in those 60 relief innings (about a season’s worth) is 2.85.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:39pm at 12:39 pm (UTC -4)
Compared to Figgy’s relief numbers he’s an all star.
Figgy’s relief line: .340 .419 .415 .834 18 hits in 12 innings.
Misch: .293 .389 .390 .780
Also Misch’s career splits
vs RH: .284 .342 .454 .796
vs LH: .286 .340 .458 .798
There is no doubt that Misch has more value to the Mets and most likely other teams than the 35 year old journey man.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:28pm at 12:28 pm (UTC -4)
I would think considering he pitched in twice as many relief appearances as GS last year that they still consider him a reliever. Also, how many games has he started this ST?
LOL Omar and Manuel say a lot of things but rarely follow up on those.
Did you look at how bad Figgy was as a reliever last year?
trs86
3/17/2010-12:34pm at 12:34 pm (UTC -4)
Also, I think based on what I can find from the quote that Jerry did not think of him as a lefty specialist but he could be depth for #5 or as the longman.
saltygary
3/17/2010-12:25pm at 12:25 pm (UTC -4)
I think there is a big difference between the 2. Nieve has only played 8 games for the Mets where Parnell has had a full season of being jerked around by the club.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:32pm at 12:32 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t think he was jerked around as much as he just wasn’t any good.
The guy wasn’t very good in the minors either.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:35pm at 12:35 pm (UTC -4)
Full season of being jerked around? He was slid in the rotation late in the year after struggling in the pen the 2nd half.
ceetar
3/17/2010-12:23pm at 12:23 pm (UTC -4)
I go back and forth on Parnell. I like him, and think he has talent and can succeed, but I also think he’d gain a lot from some time in the minors working his pitches.
I’m never good at picking out my 7 relievers, so I’ll not nitpick. plenty of guys to go up and down as the year progresses. gotta keep Takahashi around to see more though I feel.
saltygary
3/17/2010-12:26pm at 12:26 pm (UTC -4)
I hear that. I think at some point over the next 2 months most of these guys will be in the pen at some point. It really is a tough area to gauge.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:24pm at 12:24 pm (UTC -4)
I guess we are assuming Niese wins the fifth starter spot. Personally, I’d lean toward Takahashi for that role just because I think he is prepared to help from the get go and I am not convinced Niese is.
Anyway, I also think Takahashi can help from the pen so I’d levae him there as the long man. Hence, there is no need for Figueroa in the pen.
I’d go with the same pen and sub in either Green (your ROOGY to counter to Feliciano as your LOOGY) or Misch.
I’d rather protect Misch from being claimed than Figgy.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:40pm at 12:40 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed, right now the winner HAS to be Taka.
metro
3/17/2010-12:26pm at 12:26 pm (UTC -4)
I really wish the Mets had a legit “2nd lefty” aka a guy who could give Feliciano less work and potentially allow more use of Feliciano in the 8th vs. when we have to use him earlier.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:29pm at 12:29 pm (UTC -4)
Why can’t Misch or Takahashi be that guy? Neither are LOOGY types but I think that is a credit. Each guy can easily handle an inning. Takahashi’s curve has looked very good v. lefties.
metro
3/17/2010-12:33pm at 12:33 pm (UTC -4)
I can’t speak for Takahashi but Misch has HORRID career numbers vs. lefties. Maybe Takahashi can perform that role but Misch career vs. lefties- 286/340/458 which = not someone you can bring in for the purpose of getting lefties out.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:39pm at 12:39 pm (UTC -4)
a .340 OBP against is not horrible. The SLG is not good.
And my point is that Misch would not be used as a LOOGY. Feliciano would be.
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:43pm at 12:43 pm (UTC -4)
mishc would be a long man, mop up guy, spot starter, and come in for an inning when needed, more so if there were lefties due up.
He is also young enough to be just now reaching his prime, so it can be reasonably expected that he will improve upon his career numbers.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:46pm at 12:46 pm (UTC -4)
He is a younger Darren Oliver.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:42pm at 12:42 pm (UTC -4)
Why not Calero who’s numbers against LH are
.244 .352 .373 .725 for his career and
.187 .347 .240 .587 last season?
metro
3/17/2010-12:37pm at 12:37 pm (UTC -4)
Here is the quote-
.Pat Misch will be in camp as a starting pitcher, not competing for the second lefty spot in the bullpen with Pedro Feliciano, Jerry Manuel said. Fernando Nieve has been anointed as the early leader in a fifth-starter competition that also includes Jon Niese and Nelson Figueroa.
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/mets/2010/01/28/2010-01-28_tatis_up_for_3rd_round.html#ixzz0iS7iO8g4
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:38pm at 12:38 pm (UTC -4)
who cares what Jerry said? He mostly spouts nonsense that he doesn’t back up, assuming it isn’t already completely at odds with what the FO thinks.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-12:39pm at 12:39 pm (UTC -4)
that was the end of january?
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:43pm at 12:43 pm (UTC -4)
Misch has pitched three games and seven innings. He’s started one and was credited with a save in another.
Hardly sounds like he’s being stretched out in competition for a starting role. It’s not like his innings have been limited by poor performance like Niese’s have. Misch has given up 7 baserunners in his 7 IP compared to Niese’s 14.
Misch last appearance was a clean one inning.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:44pm at 12:44 pm (UTC -4)
Misch has matched and even surpassed Figgy’s numbers in ST this year and matched him last year. He is 8 years younger and is LH yet everyone wants to get Figgy with it. I don’t get it at all.
metro
3/17/2010-12:48pm at 12:48 pm (UTC -4)
I’m not sure why Misch being LH makes any difference when he doesn’t get lefties out. Being lefty is only an “asset” if it implies he is tough on lefties.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:50pm at 12:50 pm (UTC -4)
OK take LH out if you like. Misch has still matched if not exceeded Figgy in every way and is 7 years younger.
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:51pm at 12:51 pm (UTC -4)
he gets lefties out at the same rate as righties.
sounds more like a SP, but it isn’t fair to say he can’t get lefties out.
metro
3/17/2010-12:57pm at 12:57 pm (UTC -4)
289 BAA career vs. lefties 100% means for a lefty pitcher “he can’t get lefties out” that is a TERRIBLE number for a lefty pitcher.
trs86
3/17/2010-1:07pm at 1:07 pm (UTC -4)
Again we are still missing the larger point. What does Figgy has that gives him an advantage over Misch?
stickguy
3/17/2010-1:11pm at 1:11 pm (UTC -4)
probably not an ability to get lefties out.
Wonder what Figgys splits vs. lefties are?
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-12:49pm at 12:49 pm (UTC -4)
sentimental value for one and has been more successful than both Ollie and Maine the past 2 seasons.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:58pm at 12:58 pm (UTC -4)
Sentimental value? What the hell is that about?
As for being more successful than Ollie and Maine the past TWO seasons? Figgy would kill to have Ollie’s 2008 season.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-1:14pm at 1:14 pm (UTC -4)
10 wins and a 4.22 ERA in 34 starts while throwing 105 BB is nothing to kill for.
over the past 2 seasons Ollie has a 4.88 ERA. Figueroa’s ERA is 4.28 over the past 2 seasons (in fewer starts).
The only thing Ollie has is this “upside” which seems to only happen his first full season with a new club
trs86
3/17/2010-1:16pm at 1:16 pm (UTC -4)
LOL, you guys and your Figgy love are unbelievable. Again, when released last year and begging for a job, who signed him?
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-1:23pm at 1:23 pm (UTC -4)
last season Figueroa made 10 starts, 7 of which were quality starts and 6 of those he gave up 2 R or less. He had a 3.65 ERA in those 10 starts last season.
combine that with his 2.25 ERA in AAA last year and his 0.00 ERA in ST so far, I dont see why he shouldnt be the front runner.
trs86
3/17/2010-1:27pm at 1:27 pm (UTC -4)
LOL, who picked him up the 5 times we released him?
Take a look at Misch’s stats last year both in relief and SP and then compare his stats this ST and factor in age. Tell me why Figgy should make it over him.
trs86
3/17/2010-1:28pm at 1:28 pm (UTC -4)
You know, I am done with Figgymania. You guys can keep up the parade. When he gets released and then ends up signing back with the Mets for AAA you can join the Bison parade.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-1:32pm at 1:32 pm (UTC -4)
thats not the point. the point is he will give us the best chance of winning compared to any of the other options (except maybe Takahashi).
Mr North Jersey
3/17/2010-3:11pm at 3:11 pm (UTC -4)
Out of curiosity when you say Misch has surpassed Figgy’s numbers in ST this year what number are those that you are referring to?
trs86
3/17/2010-8:39pm at 8:39 pm (UTC -4)
He is 100% in his save opportunities. LOL
I misspoke as last time I looked Misch did have slight better stats as he had given up less hits and walks however I must have missed their last 2 starts in there.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:43pm at 12:43 pm (UTC -4)
Right and later on we find this: New York Mets’ Pat Misch makes pitch for rotation, but relief role beckons. NYPost March 4th.
metro
3/17/2010-12:47pm at 12:47 pm (UTC -4)
Read the article MISCH says he can pitch out of the pen not the Mets.
“I think I have a good opportunity to make the starting rotation,” said Misch, who surrendered one hit and two walks in three scoreless innings. “I think that’s where I can help the team. If that doesn’t work out – I mean, there’s a lot of great guys – I’ve also pitched out of the pen before.”
Also the interest in Biemel implies they want a lefty who can get lefties out more than a long man.
trs86
3/17/2010-12:49pm at 12:49 pm (UTC -4)
Or that perhaps Misch is a guy that is considered for the longman and has nothing to do with a lefty specialist. LOL I did read the article.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-12:50pm at 12:50 pm (UTC -4)
that article was written over a month ago…things change like Niese and Nieve both pitching poorly in ST…
metro
3/17/2010-12:52pm at 12:52 pm (UTC -4)
Unless Takahashi is the 5th starter I don’t see how Misch is on the team at all. I’d be stunned if Misch won the longman job over Takahashi so his only chance is to take the role that Takahashi looks headed toward which is longman with Takahashi being the #5. Your not going to carry both Takahashi and Misch in the pen.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:56pm at 12:56 pm (UTC -4)
Why not? Misch doesn’t have L/R splits and can be your long man while Taka can be your “second lefty.”
Feliciano is not exactly gangbusters v. righties: 272 .364 .425. The Mets would be better served with him as a LOOGY and Taka pitching a full inning v. lefties and righties.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-1:03pm at 1:03 pm (UTC -4)
well Takahashi doesnt belong in the pen as long as Im concerned. Until he has a bad outing, how can he not be the #5 SP???
Knowing the Mets Takahashi, Figueroa and Niese will be sent down, Nieve will be the #5 SP and Misch in the pen I disagree with that but what do I know I guess…
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:51pm at 12:51 pm (UTC -4)
Lefties slugged Beimel just as bad last year as they slugged Misch. He did do a much better job at keeping them off base, though.
Beimel is a career 1.5 WHIP guy.
Given Misch’s versatilty and Beimel’s only marginal improvement v. lefties, I’d still go with Misch.
metro
3/17/2010-12:56pm at 12:56 pm (UTC -4)
Beimel SUCKS but the Mets like him enough to try and sign him.
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:37pm at 12:37 pm (UTC -4)
Right now?
Krod
Feliciano
Calero
Izzy
Misch
Neive
Yes, I know that is only 6. The last spot can go to green or parnell or everts, which ever one earns it in ST!
I don’t like green, but fear we may be stuck with him.
My reasoning? 1st, I think Taka should be the #5, and Neise in AAA to start the year. And the only non options guy I will risk losing is Figgy. Maybe he doesn’t accept the assignment, but Misch absolutely will get claimed.
And now, they need to keep as much depth as possible.
I also think Parnell should go to AAA to get a crash course as a late inning reliever, and to work on the 2nd pitch (and maybe release tweaks to get some bite on the FB?). Try to turn him into the closer of the future.
Misch can be the 2nd lefty, long man, and spot starter.
also a decent chance they snap up someone else before the end of ST for that last role.
But, they likely need all the arms they can hoard, so send down the guys with options if it is even close to a toss up.
metro
3/17/2010-12:38pm at 12:38 pm (UTC -4)
Everts was already sent to minor league camp so you can essentially eliminate him
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:40pm at 12:40 pm (UTC -4)
always a chance that he turns heads and others falter, but if they moved him over, then yes, not very likely.
But, an interesting piece for the AAA pen, and maybe he will be back mid season.
let him and parnell team up in Buffalo. Some =nice gas out there.
metro
3/17/2010-12:53pm at 12:53 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah there is always a chance but gotta figure if they are sending him to minor league camp already that they have “seen enough” to feel they don’t expect him to be ready to make the team.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-12:38pm at 12:38 pm (UTC -4)
why should Jon Niese be the starter at this point. Hes not pitching well in ST, he has options and is on par with what we have now.
id make Takahashi the SP, Misch in the pen and Niese in AAA.
with Ollie and Maine in the rotation, you are going to need Niese at some point but taking him now makes no sense…
metsfan4decades
3/17/2010-12:40pm at 12:40 pm (UTC -4)
This is my BP, based on what we know today:
KRod/Pedro/Iggy/Calero/Nieve/Misch/Parnell
This is assuming the starting rotation is:
Johan/MOP/Tak2
Let Niese go to AAA another month and build up strength/stamina a bit longer coming off that injury. Then we can switch in the rotation with Tak2 or if Tak2 is really struggling send him down to AAA.
Parnell on a short leash in the BP.
metro
3/17/2010-12:41pm at 12:41 pm (UTC -4)
Problem for me with Parnell is that his minor league numbers aren’t very good either. If he were some dominant minor league arm I could see being ultra patient with him but he is very hittable, he really currently has 1 pitch, what’s wrong with him going to AAA and closing there?
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:44pm at 12:44 pm (UTC -4)
There is a big difference to consider.
he was always a SP in the minors, right? Sending him down for “closers school” is a whole diffrent way of pitching.
metro
3/17/2010-12:45pm at 12:45 pm (UTC -4)
Yup only 2 career games out of the pen before hitting the majors. I would make him the Buffalo closer (it’s not as if they have anyone there that he will be “blocking”) and let him grow confident as a reliever.
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:49pm at 12:49 pm (UTC -4)
exactly what I said. Crash course at closer school.
Try to tweak the FB to make it a little less hittable, and figure out what he can best handle as his 2nd “out” pitch. Slider, change, cutter. Must be something. Then just practice the hell out of it.
metro
3/17/2010-12:44pm at 12:44 pm (UTC -4)
Parnell career in the minors- 1.40 whip, 4.04 era, 8.7 h/9, and 6.64 era 1.7 whip at AAA hardly impressive numbers for a guy who throws mid 90′s. I have a strong feeling that if there were a guy with better minor league numbers but throw 90-91 people would be much quicker to agree he needed more time in the minors.
stickguy
3/17/2010-12:47pm at 12:47 pm (UTC -4)
Oh yeah, I forgot last years campaign:
No More OOGYS!
More guys like Calero that can just pitch to anybody reasonably effectively and get them out.
Of course, someone has to explain the concept to Jerry. Good luck with that.
metro
3/17/2010-12:54pm at 12:54 pm (UTC -4)
Rosenthal-
At foxsports, Ken Rosenthal argues that the Mets should not put Jenrry Mejia in the big leagues right away.
….there is growing sentiment within the Mets’ organization that Mejia should make the team as a reliever….
Such insanity is acceptable only when a player is so gifted, he can simply bypass the game’s normal ladder of progression. Mejia … actually might be that good.
Rosenthal quotes David Wright, Jason Bay, Alex Cora, K-Rod and Rod Barajas, all of whom have ahem, zero say in whether Mejia breaks camp with the big club, and Dan Warthen who will have some voice.
I’m not sure what’s wrong with Parnell and Igarashin in front of Rodriguez at all.
Also, with Reyes and Beltran out to start the season, I view the Mets as longshots now to make the playoffs. Thus, sacrificing any of Mejia’s potential development for a present that might not even exist seems to me, to get more foolhardy by the day. I’ve evolved on this to become more against Mejia breaking camp with the big league team.
All you need to know from that Rosenthal story is this Barajas quote:
He definitely still has some work to do. His secondary pitches – the curveball and changeup – he has struggled with the curveball in camp so far. We’ve been trying to work on it in games. He just hasn’t gotten that feel for it.
“You’d like to get him more seasoning down there, make him use those pitches. I think he could get major-league hitters out on a regular basis. With that fastball, he definitely can have success. But the second and third time he faces clubs, if they can just sit on one pitch, it’s going to be tough for him.â€
http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2010/03/16/mets-shouldnt-rush-phenom-mejia/
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-12:59pm at 12:59 pm (UTC -4)
There’s no question that Mejia belongs in the minors. Putting him in the pen now will essentially ensure that he is a reliever forever because he’ll never get to work on his other pitches or get the experience necessary to become a starter.
But I wouldn’t even think of using Parnell as justification for sending Mejia down. Parnell belongs with Mejia in the minors.
metro
3/17/2010-1:08pm at 1:08 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t really like the fact that Barajas says Mejia needs work on his curve (which basically every scout agrees with) and Warthen is saying otherwise (because his ass in on the line with Jerry). Rod Barajas while not Bench, IS a veteran MLB catcher who has caught the likes of Halladay, Hamels etc and I think if he says the kid needs more time then I believe it. What ulterior motive would he have?
trs86
3/17/2010-1:10pm at 1:10 pm (UTC -4)
I think we need to relax. This all could be hype and nothing more. Lets save the complaining bout the Mets turning him into a reliever until the Mets actually do it.
stickguy
3/17/2010-1:17pm at 1:17 pm (UTC -4)
true about the hype.
Look at it this way: Omar fighting to keep job. What are the 2 things that will let this happen.
1) is obviously win a boat load of games, and make the playoffs.
2) is (if 1 does not happen) is to be able to waive around a fantastic bunch of almost ready prospects, to show how he has been a good sheppard rebuilding the team for the future.
And what better way to do that, then to make a big fuss over a guy and gush about how he might make the team?
Even when they send him down, the seed has been planted. Doesn’t really matter if he knows that Mejia really needs another couple of years of development!
trs86
3/17/2010-1:19pm at 1:19 pm (UTC -4)
Or perhaps Mejia is the center-piece in a major deal.
stickguy
3/17/2010-1:20pm at 1:20 pm (UTC -4)
bite your tongue.
and if they do, it better be fore someone really good, since the most precious commodity in BB is young SP with the potential to be a stud.
trs86
3/17/2010-1:22pm at 1:22 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed. I think it most likely should be a SP as well unless they are serious about AGonz.
stickguy
3/17/2010-1:29pm at 1:29 pm (UTC -4)
that’s where I thought you were going. Something like Mejia and Davis as the primary pieces for Gonzolez.
although that certainly does make for a better looking chance in 2010! Not to mention 2011.
Scary lineup with A Gon, Beltran and Reyes all added (and poor Murphy deelted)
trs86
3/17/2010-1:37pm at 1:37 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, Grave’s piece on trading prospects comes to mind.
Sure
Reyes, Wright, Agonz, Beltran and Bay certainly would be appealing.
stickguy
3/17/2010-1:22pm at 1:22 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t really see them moving mejia, F Mart or Davis though. I really think they are serious about running with what they got, and trying to work some of these guys into the mix soon.
But, we shall see.
trs86
3/17/2010-1:22pm at 1:22 pm (UTC -4)
I hope you are right but I could see them using some this year if needed.
trs86
3/17/2010-1:13pm at 1:13 pm (UTC -4)
Not sure if anyone has noticed but Stoner has also had a good spring. 3.1 innings 2 hits 1 run 0 walks and 3 K’s.
stickguy
3/17/2010-1:19pm at 1:19 pm (UTC -4)
talk about a small sample size!
trs86
3/17/2010-2:29pm at 2:29 pm (UTC -4)
True but the guy also did decent in his 9 innings last year after the call up. Perhaps he can make a long man or #5 option after all.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-2:35pm at 2:35 pm (UTC -4)
His minor league track record suggests AAAA type guy. He has decent control, strikes out 6+/9 (not overwhelming but not terrible) and keeps the ball in the park.
I’m sure he can make some spot starts here and there. But he belongs in AAA waiting for Nise, Nieve and Taka to get injured.
trs86
3/17/2010-2:39pm at 2:39 pm (UTC -4)
I would agree. Not calling for him to make the team. Just saying he may be more useful down the road than we give him credit for.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-2:42pm at 2:42 pm (UTC -4)
We’ve been in agreement lately. I hope that doesn’t mean the world comes to an end tomorrow, though I could use a rest.
stickguy
3/17/2010-2:44pm at 2:44 pm (UTC -4)
well, it helps to have some guys like this. useful if your rotation gets beat up, can help in long relief, and can come in handy to round out a trade.
besides, every som often one of these guys masters a special pitch (like Webb with his sinker, even Hallady to some extent) and you get something special out of the deal.
wannybackstra
3/17/2010-2:25pm at 2:25 pm (UTC -4)
I thought he was talking about Ron Washington.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-1:36pm at 1:36 pm (UTC -4)
the entire future of this team rests on the performance of MOP.
1) If they are bad, we have a losing season and Francouer, Barajas are most likely gone before seasons end and F-Mart, Davis are up sooner than later.
2) If they are good we WILL be one of the best teams in the NL and competing for a chance to lose to the Yankees or Red Sox in the WS…
trs86
3/17/2010-1:39pm at 1:39 pm (UTC -4)
What if they are average? LOL. What if one is good and one is bad and one is average? What if one is REALLY bad and one is slightly less bad but the other one is exceptional?
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-1:53pm at 1:53 pm (UTC -4)
well i expect Ollie to be around 5.00 ERA, Maine missing half his starts and a 4.5 ERA and Pelf to pitch all season with an era around like 4.1-4.2 I believe that will give us around 80-85 W signaling the end of Maine’s tenure with the Mets and possibly Ollie’s as well…
stickguy
3/17/2010-1:47pm at 1:47 pm (UTC -4)
Gotta be in it to win it.
To be fair 9since I know that you find the MOP trio to be particularly iffy), any team that has their 3/4/5 bad isn’t likely to be fighting for the playoffs.
Unless, of course, they find replacements that are just as good if not better.
so Taka is the #5. Neise to AAA, where he get dialed in.
Then, Ollie goes down. Neise comes up, pitches better. Team soldiers on.
Then, Maine goes down. Omar takes his saved payroll budget+ a tier B prospect or 2 and gets a salary dump SP. Team soldiers on.
Any of this guaranteed? Nope. But teams change their rotation during the season “on the fly” all the time.
Look at last years Phils (everyone’s favorite it seems). The end of the season (+ playoff) rotation had Lee, Pedro, and Happ in it. None of them were in the rotation to start the year, and 2 weren’t even with the Phils (and Happ was either a loogy in the pen or in AAA).
so comparable for the Mets would be Pedro, Neise and and Chris Young (or some other overpaid guy heading toward FA).
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-2:00pm at 2:00 pm (UTC -4)
well I believe that Pelfrey can go back to his 07 but I dont think he will be quite as good.
I expect Maine to repeat last seasons performance and Ollie to be healthy but almost as bad.
I expect one of the guys competing for the 5th spot to have a decent year.
What im hoping for is that the Mets can at least stay above .500 until june. that way the season can still be saved when Reyes gets back (i expect him to miss a while) and Beltran as well
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-2:05pm at 2:05 pm (UTC -4)
Pelf’s 08 season that is
trs86
3/17/2010-2:09pm at 2:09 pm (UTC -4)
Thing is that over the time Ollie has been here when healthy he has not been “bad”.
oleosmirf
3/17/2010-2:15pm at 2:15 pm (UTC -4)
well he was horrendous in september of 08 and ever since then has been on the decline. thats also if you believe injuries were the only cause of his problems last year.
not to mention the fact that his inability to pitch deep into games wont translate into wins without a great bullpen…and our current bullpen is very questionable outside of K-Rod and Feliciano
trs86
3/17/2010-2:21pm at 2:21 pm (UTC -4)
OK so that means his numbers were above average in 2008 before September? LOL. Perez when healthy has been a high 3′s to low 4′s ERA guy that K’s a lot and walks a lot while pitching 5.7-6.1 innings per start. He is what he is.
stickguy
3/17/2010-2:31pm at 2:31 pm (UTC -4)
but now he is skinnier and in better shape at least.
trs86
3/17/2010-2:32pm at 2:32 pm (UTC -4)
I hope that translates but I will be more than happy with the results we have gotten from him when he is healthy. If he can be the 4.00 ERA 195 innings guy I will take it now.