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Grave, Mets, Player Moves
by Mr North Jersey
#Mets bumping IF Alex Cora off roster. That will be the move to clear a spot for Tejada. #MLBless than a minute ago via Twitter for BlackBerryÂ®Ken RosenthalKen_Rosenthal
8/7/2010-12:37pm at 12:37 pm (UTC -4)
Also this: AdamRubinESPN
Source: Alex Cora released, Jesus Feliciano demoted.
8/7/2010-12:40pm at 12:40 pm (UTC -4)
i think its only a matter of time before Frenchy is gone…although this is why I have wanted Jerry gone and replaced with a puppet like Oberkfell. Jerry wont manage for next season so I expect Frenchy to see plenty of action…
8/7/2010-12:49pm at 12:49 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed. Frenchy cannot see much action. The time of the kids has come.
As the Chamberlain Brothers once sang, “Time has come today… TIME!”
8/7/2010-1:08pm at 1:08 pm (UTC -4)
at least Castillo now gets more time at 2B next season!!!!
8/7/2010-12:39pm at 12:39 pm (UTC -4)
Also this: Ken_Rosenthal
Source: Carlos Delgado agrees to minor-league deal with #RedSox. Must be in majors by Sept. 1 or he can become free agent.
8/7/2010-12:47pm at 12:47 pm (UTC -4)
Uh….well good luck to Delgado. I’m thinking he’ll struggle as much as Beltran has, seeing as they’ve both been out of baseball about the same time and Beltran only had one surgery and a less invasive one at that.
Well, it’s the right thing to do. It’s about time they started making some changes, not only to see if we can win some ballgames before the season is over but for the future.
I’m assuming, referencing grave’s post above, both Tejada and FMart will be on their way?
8/7/2010-12:41pm at 12:41 pm (UTC -4)
yup lets hope F-mart plays well enough to make them move Beltran in the offseason…
this is all based on beltran waiving his NTC, right? With all the talk of trading Beltran, I’m second guessing myself on whether he does have that NTC or not.
8/7/2010-12:50pm at 12:50 pm (UTC -4)
Not only does he have a no trade clause, he has a no arbitration clause as well. Meaning if we did trade him, the team picking him up and the last year of his contract can’t offer him arbitration when the contract is up, getting the picks if he refuses.
To me…that just makes it that much harder to trade him, along with money that is owed on his current contract.
I’d be very surprised if a team took a chance on him given all that, and the fact that he still hasn’t proved he’s healthy enough to contribute at the level he did.
8/7/2010-12:51pm at 12:51 pm (UTC -4)
Whoops. What you said.
He has one but that’s not the most horrifying thing in his contract. Check out the last line:
# 7 years/$119M (2005-11)
* signed by NY Mets as a free agent 1/05
* $11M signing bonus
o $5M at signing 1/05, $2M 6/15/05, $2M 1/15/06, $2M 1/15/07
* 05:$10M, 06:$12M, 07:$12M, 08:$18.5M, 09:$18.5M, 10:$18.5M, 11:$18.5M
* full no-trade clause
* $22M ($5.5M annually from 2008-11 salaries) deferred at 1.72% compounded interest
* club agreed to not offer arbitration after 2011 season
8/7/2010-1:02pm at 1:02 pm (UTC -4)
That Boras is one smart dude, huh? Sigh….
I can only hope, with the changes in the economic climate and ownership/GMs around the league realizing how some of these big, long term contracts could come back to bit them in later years, that clauses like no arbitration will be few and far between going forward..
Not that this has anything to do with the Mets, but I’ll be curious to see how the Arod and Tex contracts play out going down the line. Not to mention the fact that they’re going to have to resign Jeter, they’re going to have to pay him more than any other team would and they’re going to have to play an aging SS with little range left, somewhere….
8/7/2010-1:07pm at 1:07 pm (UTC -4)
well the Mets certainly would not get something major in return but it still makes perfect sense for the Sawks to trade Dice-K for him straight up.
they have Lackey, Lester, Buchholtz and Beckett already plus Dubront, Wakefield, Bowden for the 5th spot, they have no use for Dice-K.
Dice-K is owed 20 mil for 2 years and Beltran is owed 19 mil for 1. The Sawks have outfield issues and the Mets are in need of a SP. It seems like a pretty good match to me…
8/7/2010-1:12pm at 1:12 pm (UTC -4)
You would really trade Beltran for Dice straight up? Are you f***ing kidding me?!!! Dice K is always injured, he’s had 1 really good season!
You’re going to trade a guy who is capable of 30+hr’s, 100+ rbi out of centerfield, and who when healthy is a tremendous fielder for a number 4 pitcher!!!! Outrageous.
8/7/2010-1:16pm at 1:16 pm (UTC -4)
i hear you, but you are comparing healthy Beltran with broken Beltran. Hence my “crap” comment below. Yes, he was capable, but I just don’t see it any more. I hope for it, but I don’t see it.
I mean, Keith was productive, then his back got busted up and it was a stone sinking in a pool after that. Straight down.
8/7/2010-1:20pm at 1:20 pm (UTC -4)
no Beltran is not capable of hitting 30 HR and 100 RBI anymore and it gives the Mets 9 mil in salary relief this offseason which means we could really improve the holes in the pen, 2B, RF and the bench.
Dice-K going from Fenway to Citi would be great for him. He might be a #4 pitcher for Boston but for us he would be a #2 or #3. 8-3 with a 3.96 ERA in the AL East.
so yes i would rather have Dice-K and the money available to get a stopgap 2B and 8th inning guy than the declining Beltran.
8/7/2010-1:13pm at 1:13 pm (UTC -4)
Couldn’t hurt. Until, that is, he gets lit up like a roman candle. Then again, it’s not like Beltran is ripping it up either. Here’s my crap for your crap.
The fact that you guys are calling Beltran trash is disgusting, and as a Met fan it’s embarrassing. You’re no better than any of the Yankees fans who complain that Vasquez is their number 5 pitcher, and they need Lee.
He is coming off a big injury. How did Reyes look when he came back in the beginning of the season? He was our best player 06-08, and along with Delgado carried us in ’06 playoffs, when your homegrown heroes did jack. He was hitting .325 last season before he got hurt last year, and was a tremendous center fielder for us. And he gets 1 big injury, and you guys turn your back on him and throw him to the dogs. Disgusting!
8/7/2010-1:27pm at 1:27 pm (UTC -4)
Geez, you sound like the old me!
I largely agree, except NJStuck is clearly among the MOST reasonable and level-headed people on here.
8/7/2010-1:30pm at 1:30 pm (UTC -4)
you are assuming Beltran will come back to his old self,
i expect .280 15 HR 70 RBI from Tron next season but i’d rather have Dice-K and salary relief than a declining Beltran…
How is it embarrassing? He’s broken. bone on bone. Like I said, I hope he plays like he’s capable and i hope that drives us to the World series, but looking at 2 broken players, and the Mets needs combined with the GLUT of OF options, it does make sense. And currently, it would be crap for crap. Now, Beltran’s crap may be manure and out of said manure 1 last flower sprouts, but the likelihood of that happening isn’t large.
And why, as fans of a team, are we not afforded the luxury of, as you say, “turning our back on him and throwing him to the dogs”? I root for the name on the front of the Jersey, not the back. Why did Beltran hinder the Mets with his contract language? You can spin this any way you want and I’m not buying the kick him to the curb theory.
8/7/2010-1:44pm at 1:44 pm (UTC -4)
He’s been up for not even a month! How did Reyes look when he came back? It’s centerfield. How many good center fielders are there in baseball? Even the yankees don’t have a consistent center fielder. Now if you want to tell me you think they should switch Pagan to Center and Beltron to Right, I’m all for that. But to call a guy who’s been one of the best in the game finished after 20 games coming off an injury, when he should have played more minor league games to me is just plain silly.
8/7/2010-2:00pm at 2:00 pm (UTC -4)
a 27 year old with a thyroid condition and a 34 year old witha permanently damaged knee are completely different.
To say Beltran is just rusty and that his knee is 100% to where it was in 2008 is a little naive…
8/7/2010-2:07pm at 2:07 pm (UTC -4)
to claim a one time star done after 20 bad games is naive as well.
8/7/2010-2:14pm at 2:14 pm (UTC -4)
i didnt say done, i said declining…
its all about the money and Beltran’s contract is a problem. that 19 mil could be much better spent than what it is now…
8/7/2010-1:17pm at 1:17 pm (UTC -4)
I would rather have Beltran in his Boras-fueled free agent salary drive season than Dice-K who led the league in walks during his one standout season.
8/7/2010-4:01pm at 4:01 pm (UTC -4)
8/7/2010-2:16pm at 2:16 pm (UTC -4)
I grew up around the
even make you
agree to shake down deals
Or for that matter
Bobby Bo’s deal!
8/7/2010-1:09pm at 1:09 pm (UTC -4)
Why would you trade Beltran? His value is going to be diminished, so in addition to trading him for less value than he’s worth, we’re going to have to pick up some of his contract. It’s a contract year before probably the last contract he’ll ever get, he’s going to come to play next year.
O, and I hope Delgado tears it up for the Sox, eliminates the Yanks, and shows all the stupid Mets fans who knocked him how valuable he really is. Remember what home runs look like guys?
I have to agree with this also. Next year is Beltran’s walk year. Players are notorious for bringing it on during their walk year. Since I believe his contract is going to be very hard to move, and would probably have to take back very little in return, I’d rather take my chances on Beltran having a very good year in 2011.
because i would rather have Pagan in CF, F-mart in RF, Dice-K in the rotation Hudson/Uribe at 2B and a legit 8th inning guy than Beltran in CF, Pagan in RF, Harang in the rotation and Castillo/Tejada at 2B and Parnell as the 8th inning guy.
we need a balanced team and to do that we need to get rid of his salary…
8/7/2010-1:40pm at 1:40 pm (UTC -4)
What has F-Mart done for you to be ready to hand him the starting RF job and expect us to win with an outfield of Pagan (I love him this year, but this is the first ever time he’s stayed healthy for an entire season), and Bay (do I need to even get into Bay?), the infield will pretty much be the same, and maybe you add a pitcher. And you think that is going to get us to win? Not buying it.
8/7/2010-1:52pm at 1:52 pm (UTC -4)
well the idea is that these 2 months will be an indication of whether he is ready. Obviously if F-Mart stinks and Beltran has a great September than things change but i am talking about if Beltran doesnt pick it up and F-Mart has a very good August/Sept.
i am willing to downgrade at RF in order to upgrade SP, RP, 2B and the bench.
8/7/2010-2:06pm at 2:06 pm (UTC -4)
But Oleo, how much playing time is he going to get? You’re ready with all that has been going on, even if he has a relatively good 2 months, after 2 months to just give him the starting role and expect us to win? To me, if f-mart has any success whatsoever, trade him! Please trade him for a pitcher!
8/7/2010-2:10pm at 2:10 pm (UTC -4)
i dont see us winning next season regardless so i would rather see F-mart get his rookie season over with than a declining Beltran.
we can’t win until the holes are gone…
8/7/2010-1:10pm at 1:10 pm (UTC -4)
Ah fantastic! I’m so glad that Cora and his “leadership qualities” are off the team, especially in 2011.
Also, Jesus down, FMart up!
8/7/2010-1:15pm at 1:15 pm (UTC -4)
Prismo, here’s the thing:
Do you really think the reason they dropped Cora had anything to do with his attitude or abilities? No, it is 1 thing and 1 thing only, and it’s the fact that if he plays something like 18 more games he is owed more money. It’s all about the money, and don’t be fooled for a second. If they really wanted to make a difference they’d drop Ollie who’s wasting a spot on the roster, or luis “i’m terrible at every aspect of the game” castillo.
At least our once time top prospect who we could have traded for top talent when we were serious WS contendors can now ride the bench!
Oh I absolutely I agree with you, and I would’ve done it because of the money as well. He’s played terribly this year and isn’t even worth league minimum, so why force yourself to pay him another $2MM next season?
8/7/2010-1:22pm at 1:22 pm (UTC -4)
yeah he probably should have been released, but what annoys me is there are a good 4 people at least on the roster that should go down before him.
8/7/2010-1:25pm at 1:25 pm (UTC -4)
Uh…it should be about the money. As in instead of waiting for that option to vest, they released him before it could, thereby freeing up that money.
I don’t understand the problem some seem to have with that?
Ollie and Castillo should be gone also, money be damned, but with those two, the money is spent whether they’re here or not. By releasing Cora, they saved that money – hopefully to be used elsewhere.
Agreed, agreed, agreed.
Prefer Carter down instead of Jesus, but hey, you cannot have everything.
Pretty funny/sad that moves like this are enough to get us excited!
8/7/2010-1:18pm at 1:18 pm (UTC -4)
It just confirms to us that the front office is actually alive!
8/7/2010-1:31pm at 1:31 pm (UTC -4)
Ah, so THAT’s what this blissful feeling is!!
8/7/2010-1:35pm at 1:35 pm (UTC -4)
Pictures of Gene Wilder from Young Frankenstein yelling “it’s alive!” run through my head.
8/7/2010-1:49pm at 1:49 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, well, Peter Boyle’s monster did turn out smart in the end….and that movie was hilarious—this one isn’t!
One of my all-time top favorites…I think I know that screenplay even better than I know how many times Carter has not gotten on base!
I don’t understand the mindset of some Met fans. Most have been complaining all season about Cora, his contract, that vesting option, how he’s got nothing left. So the Mets finally release him and Met fans are still complaining.
Yes, maybe they should have never given him that contract to begin with, especially with that vesting option. And maybe it would have been far better to move him coming into this season instead of waiting this long.
Point is, they did release him before that option vests (18 games left). They are at least looking to save that money going forward so it can be used for other pieces needed. What’s not to like about this?
8/7/2010-1:32pm at 1:32 pm (UTC -4)
who is complaining?
8/7/2010-4:03pm at 4:03 pm (UTC -4)
Wasn’t implying anyone on this thread was complaining. Just reading the reactions of other Met blogs and there is some kind of whining going on this afternoon….
They should have reassigned him to a coaching role in the minors lol ;p
8/7/2010-1:37pm at 1:37 pm (UTC -4)
MF4D, anyone who complains about releasing Cora is simply a person who whines because they like to whine. We have far fewer folks like that here than most other similar places, but, like insects, they are everywhere.
Cora could not play, and was about to have another year guaranteed. Releasing him now was perhaps the single best, most economical, least harmful move they could make.
And that’s a fact.
Castillo can play a little, and his money is guaranteed. Someone else might take Ollie in a disease-for-disease swap, and his money is also guaranteed.
Losing Cora is losing zero production and freeing up a couple million for 2011, and based on everything we have seen, those couple of million could be huge in the offseason.
8/7/2010-1:55pm at 1:55 pm (UTC -4)
Castillo cannot play a little. He can’t get on base anymore because pitchers have realized they can just throw him any kind of strike and he will ground out to second. He can’t field for sh**, and botches half of every dp chance he gets. He has no value whatsoever. Especially if you’re going to bat him eigth, which is what they have been doing.
Do you not think the Mets have tried to move Ollie? I’m sure they’ve tried as hard as possible, and his value is only going down and down and down as he rides the bench and refuses to go to the minors.
Who is going to take Castillo? NOBODY. Who’s going to take Ollie? Maybe maybe by some miracle, you can get a Carlos Zambrano. So the only value that Ollie has is that if we are extremely lucky we can trade him for another headcase scrub! O yipee. I know it’s alot of money, but it’s ny, it’s a new stadium, it’s a demoralized team and fanbase, grow a pair wilpons and cut your loss.
Because Metsfan4decades, it’s how they treat us fans. They try to distract us with meaningless bs to try and get us to be excited and buy tickets, when in reality they’re doing nothing to help the team and it’s a joke. Yes I agree that there is nothing wrong with saving money. But it’s two freakin mil for a guy who brings some intangibles, and has actually been on winning teams, and has somewhat of a respect for the game. Am I that upset that he’s gone? No, not really, he can stay, he can go, it really doesn;t matter, but my problem is that they could have used these call ups to release the trouble makers and at least show us fans they have some respect for us, but no they just try to save money and say “ooo loogit, we called up f-mart! the future! we are building for the future! We care!” when in reality hes going to see alot of the bench, and he’s not ready at the moment to be called up. I like Tejada, but it makes no sense for him to come up and sit on the bench for luis, which he will be doing, when he can be getting some valuable playing time in AAA, which not many 20 year olds get to do. That is the problem Metsfan4d.
8/7/2010-1:41pm at 1:41 pm (UTC -4)
You make solid points here. It’ll all come down to The General doing what’s right for the team and playing these kids vs. doing what’s right for his situation (IE, trying to keep his job). Will he or won’t he… Film at 11.
8/7/2010-1:46pm at 1:46 pm (UTC -4)
If they come out and say that F-Mart and Tejada will be starting, then I can get behind that, but if they are just going to play them off the bench, well then, you just got dooped by the Mets front office once again.
that 2 mil they save for Cora can be spent somewhere more useful.
for example instead of signing Felipe Lopez for 1 year 2 mil, they can sign Orlando Hudson for 1 year 4 mil, or instead of Elmer Dessens at 1 mil, they can sign a more reliable reliever at 3 mil…
You are way off base here.
Castillo and Perez’s money is guaranteed for next year, and as diminished as Castillo is, he can be a good platoon with Tejada.
Ollie is a horrible case, but again, the team is finished, one extra bullpen man means nothing, and MAYBE we can get something like Bradley or Zambrano in an Ollie deal at some point.
Cora’s “intangibles”-which may or may not really amount to much-are useless on this team. Guaranteeing him 2 million for next year would have been a disaster, especially considering the clearly diminished payroll we will be dealing with.
And I respectfully submit—you would be among the folks whining about it if Cora’s millions for next year kicked in.
Excellent move, and as NJStuck says, it shows a damn pulse in the front office.
8/7/2010-1:57pm at 1:57 pm (UTC -4)
Castillo should not be playing next season for us. With Reyes and Pagan batting 1-2 we dont need a slap hitter and high OBP guy, we need someone who can drive in the runs at the bottom of the order. We need someone who when Wright, Davis, Bay are on base can actually drive them in…
8/7/2010-2:18pm at 2:18 pm (UTC -4)
I agree Oleo. All I am saying is that, unlike Cora, his money for 2011 is guaranteed. Also unlike Cora, he clearly can be at least somewhat productive for the rest of 2011. Also unlike Cora, he MIGHT have value to another team in a trade.
“intangibles” – oh come on – you actually buy that BS? Explain to me what that means, PLEASE. Dictionary.com: “intangible: not definite or clear to the mind” A quality a player has that no one can explain is reason to keep him on a team?
“has actually been on winning teams” – LOL. Do you know how many terrible, awful players have been on winning teams? Rosters are quite large, and no team has a roster full of winners. Furthermore, Cora was on these winning teams when he was younger and a better baseball player. He has clearly declined in the last couple years. This honestly doesn’t mean **** unless you’re an above average player.
“has somewhat of a respect for the game” – who doesn’t? I’d like you to take a roster, any roster, and list the guys who you think respect the game and who don’t. I think you’d find that the vast majority take their jobs seriously and work hard to be the best player they can be. So is this a reason to keep a guy? Not in the least.
Does Cora have some leadership qualities? Sure, it seems as if he does. And it seems as if he’s a fairly intelligent baseball guy. But once his skills declined that translates better into coach than ballplayer.
8/7/2010-1:50pm at 1:50 pm (UTC -4)
I said that cora could stay, Cora could go, I really don’t give a s***. My point about the intangibles, and other stuff is that at least he has somewhat of a value, compared to a Castillo, a Perez, a Carter.
I’m sorry if you got the impression that I really like Cora, all i was saying is that a NY team shouldn’t be going crazy over 2 million dollars for a back up infielder.
My main gripe is that F-Mart and Tejada are just riding the bench, and that you are only hurting their development, which is why I;m not gonna get too caught up in the fact that they are getting brought up.
I mainly agree about the latter statement, especially with FMart, which is why I’m not too excited about that move. With Bay coming back, Beltran, Pagan, and Frenchy…how much time will FMart actually see?
+ Many, many, many
It seems that we’ve been on the same page since the Mets started sucking again. That must be the key to our friendship.
Nah, it’s just me recognizing wisdom.
8/7/2010-2:23pm at 2:23 pm (UTC -4)
I appreciate that!
8/7/2010-4:07pm at 4:07 pm (UTC -4)
Well, you have a right to your opinion. I just don’t happen to agree with all your points.
Spin it anyway you want….’intangibles’ that Cora might have brought is not worth 2MIL bucks, especially when no way should Cora be on this team next year. Releasing him now was the right call.
As far as some of your other points, I agree.
Release Ollie, for crying out loud.
Castillo should not be on this team next year.
I don’t much care one way or the other if they release of trade Franceour now but he’d better not be on this team next year.
As far as how much FMart and Tejada plays…that remains to be seen.
as i said when cora was first signed (back in the mattsblog days), cora’s production could easily be matched for the major league minimum.
8/7/2010-2:12pm at 2:12 pm (UTC -4)
It’s like you can see the future. Check RDMB in 20 minutes.
8/7/2010-2:29pm at 2:29 pm (UTC -4)
with Beltran it all comes down to the money. the guy is owed 19 million dollars next season and given the Mets payroll concerns it is probably best for the team to move his contract even for a bag of balls.
I wish Carlos the best and if he hits 40 HR for the Cubs, Red Sox etc. then great for him but we way have too many holes and not enough money to address them all if we are going to pay Beltran 19 million. There just isnt enough money to pay Beltran 19 mil, pay Castillo and Ollie to leave (yes i know the money is spent anyway but its a matter of principle for the Wilpons) and spend 5 mil on a 2B, 8-10 mil on a SP, 5 mil on a RF if F-mart isnt ready, 4 mil on an 8th inning guy and build a strong bench.
8/7/2010-2:41pm at 2:41 pm (UTC -4)
If you are still here, say something, as I have your Willie Dixon CD recommendations!!
And belated happy b-day!
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