" I think this song says it all !!!"
There is a old saying ” Full me one – shame on me , full me twice – shame on me – full me three times … WELL I MUST BE RETARDED !!!” Yes folks since Oliver Perez signed that three year contract worth thirty six million dollars three years ago I have tried my best to justify that contract. Well maybe for the first two and a half years that is.
At the beginning of the ’09 season, you could make a good case for Oliver Perez, he won 15 games the season prior, he had the reputation of being a big game pitcher against bigger name teams and the friendly confines of the recently opened Citi Field should help coax his numbers to being on par with some of the top pitchers in the league. Well I was there at the second exhibition game the Mets played at the newly opened and soon to be Picard owned ball field . It was Oliver Perez versus the Boston Red Sox, and I figured it would be a awesome experience. It was a awesome experience if you were either a Sox fan or a sadist. Ollie got mauled in his first 2 innings of work , giving up about seven runs. This would act as a precursor to the next season and a half when there wasn’t your typical ” Good Ollie”/”Bad Ollie” performance. Instead we got ” Bad Ollie”/ ” Putrid Ollie ” !!! To save face from the fall out from this boondoggle of epic proportions, the Mets claimed he had injured his knee . The funny thing is the Mets forgot to debrief the ” Sultan of Suckitude ” of which knee he had ” injured” and when questioned by the media Ollie pointed to the wrong appendage.As we know Ollie did come back after a minor surgery and a minor league rehab stint, but he was still ineffective.
That next offseason us fans were poised to forgive Mr. Perez after he went to get himself into game shape by attending one of the best fitness centers based out of Arizona. Ollie came to camp looking like a man with a chip on his shoulder, and we fans were psyched. We thought ” Maybe last season was a aberration” . Too bad all of that good will lasted until the middle of Spring training when he was pummelled in almost every game that he pitched.
But we ( or at least me ) rationalized it as ” Spring training games don’t count“. That mantra changed to “ It’s only the first month of the season“, which quickly changed to ” RELEASE THIS INGRATE !!! ” after he refused a demotion to the minors to . Yes he ended up going after coming down with a ” phantom injury“. But he even stunk up Rookie ball during his minor league rehab assignment.
But the previous regime was either to timid – or too pig headed to come to terms that Ollie was a 36 million dollar bust . They so desperately wanted to justify his signing to that contract, but by the end of the season ” Dead Scrub Walking” was relegated to the bullpen , only to be used as a mop up man when games were to far out of reach to mount a comeback. The ultimate insult was when he walked in the winning run on the last day of the season.
So far Ollie has proven that he is no longer capable of being a starting pitcher, and had been put into the bullpen just to see how he can fare against left handed hitters. So far he has walked a few but allowed no runs while his fastball has charted in the mid 80′s. It scares me that he hasn’t screwed the pooch yet because you know that that implosion is just around the corner… We just have to hope that Sandy Alderson cuts the wires on this ticking time bomb before it wipes out what remains of a once fervent fan base.
Like I said ” Full me once … shame on me – but this time I won’t be fooled again” !!!
And with that said…. HERE COMES THE INFAMY !!!
Mets alumni celebrating a birthday today include:
The first catcher ever catcher to ever play in a official Mets game , Hobie Landrith is 81 (1930) . Hobie played 23 games for the Mets before being traded for soon to be fan favorite Marv Throneberry.
Back up third baseman from the ’74 season, Rich Puig is 58(1953).
Middle reliever from the ’05 season, Don Florence is 44 (1967) .
Reserve infielder from the ’08 season, Abraham Nuñez is 35 (1976) .
The New York Mets traded reserve outfielder, Bob Gallagher to the San Francisco Giants for reserve outfielder, Leon Brown on March 16, 1976.
Thw New York Mets released reserve second baseman, Danny Garcia on March 16, 2005.
And while you sit impatiently waiting for Oliver Perez to be released, just remember that there are just 16 Dwight Gooden days left until the Mets open the 2011 season against the Florida Marlins in Miami and just 23 days until the Mets 2011 home opener against the Washington Nationals at Citi Field.
Mo Vaughn is thinking of becoming a replacement player if the NFL starts fielding a team of scrubs if the lockout can’t be resolved by August.
105 comments
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-7:02am at 7:02 am (UTC -4)
No argument on any thing here from me.
If Perez had like 2 MIL left on his contract he would be long gone. Very commendable they’re giving him every opportunity but realistically, the only reason they are is because of that 12 MIL.
There is no way I want him in the BP. On a good day is walk rate is too high. His fastball has lost about 5 mph, for whatever reason.
Can you see Perez entering the game in the 8th against Philly and promptly walking Howard and Ibanez? Then he comes out for the RH batter. The other BP guys are going to become very proficient in coming in with men on base.
Ugh…just release him – please.
darknova306
3/16/2011-8:43am at 8:43 am (UTC -4)
The thought of Ollie coming into an important part of a game the team could win is sickening. Let him go suck for someone else.
darknova306
3/16/2011-8:41am at 8:41 am (UTC -4)
I was one of the few that was eagerly anticipating seeing Ollie walk away into free agency. None of that “young lefty with potential moving into a spacious ballpark and is poised for a big year” nonsense meant anything. He was trash then, and he’s trash now. He needs to go. The sooner the better.
“That next offseason us fans were poised to forgive Mr. Perez after he went to get himself into game shape”
Really? Were you at Opening Day that year? Did you hear the reaction to Ollie being announced? It took 2009 for the fanbase to realize what kind of trash Ollie is, and there was no turning back once that happened.
rustyjr
3/16/2011-8:46am at 8:46 am (UTC -4)
Yes I was – I meant during spring training – and oh yeah I had a mental fart – it’s fool me not full me so leave me alone in regards to my spelling today lol
njstuckintx
3/16/2011-8:46am at 8:46 am (UTC -4)
Full me once?
But I digest…
enough of the wordplay and flim flammery. Yes, please release the deadwood now. do it!
wannybackstra
3/16/2011-9:00am at 9:00 am (UTC -4)
Some Spring Training notes from the stat sheet: Josh Thole is on fire (hitting .419 in 31 at bats) but more importantly he’s showing some pop with 2 dingers in those 31 at bats.
At 8 for 24 with 4 BB and 3K, Hu is showing at least the possibility of offensive promise.
If he plays, Dan Murphy will hit.
Willie Harris and Scott Hairston are both having the types of Springs that will make it impossible for Nick Evans to make the team without an injury somewhere.
Jason Bay is slugging .333 through 27 at bats. He’s also struck out 11 times. Yikes. But we’ve got to give him some time to get the cobwebs out.
With 22 at bats and a .182 avg, could david wright lose his spot to evans, emaus, turner or murphy, all of whom have outhit wright so far?
Ollie has 6 BB in 8 IP. See ya.
Beato probably doesn’t belong ahead of Acosta just yet but has pitched well enough to justify it. 3 ks in 7 ip won’t cut it for him in the long run, tho.
carrasco is pitching BP.
Hard to imagine Ollie has any chance of beating out Byrdak who has been nearly perfect in just 4.1 IP.
I still see a chance of Iggy later in the year. He’s one of the few mets relievers that can miss bats. (9k in 4 IP)
If any Mets pitcher looks like he may have a big season, it could be Jon Niese.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:07am at 9:07 am (UTC -4)
Is it too early to worry about Bay? I know his average is okay and that he’s working on his new swing. But he seems to strike out every time I see him on TV.
njstuckintx
3/16/2011-9:10am at 9:10 am (UTC -4)
Stop watching TV then!
I’d give him through April. After that, it’s time to consider selling at 50 to 75 cents on the dollar, if necessary.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-9:14am at 9:14 am (UTC -4)
I’d do a trade with Bay in a NY minute if it would free up some money to resign Reyes.
njstuckintx
3/16/2011-9:17am at 9:17 am (UTC -4)
If he’s not going to be part of a rebuilt future, Bay has to be considered ‘outta here’. Then again, if he hits as you heard mentioned (30HRs, 110 Rib Eyes), he’ll be worth every cent of that contract.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:15am at 9:15 am (UTC -4)
If he gets off to a slow start, he’ll get killed by the media and the fans. Especially if Castillo and Ollie are gone.
I’m not expecting 30 HR season out of him, but 25 HR is certainly doable…
kingman 26
3/16/2011-9:18am at 9:18 am (UTC -4)
He should get killed.
He did not come to camp early as Collins requested, after having a 6 month vacation and getting about 15 million bucks for 2/3 of a season of rancid production.
And, unlike Johan and others, he did not have any sort of grueling rehab.
If he plays poorly, he deserves to be booed long and hard.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:21am at 9:21 am (UTC -4)
Ouch….
kingman 26
3/16/2011-9:26am at 9:26 am (UTC -4)
Well Kistics, I was saying this in January.
You are Jason Bay. You get a massive contract. Yes, you do hustle, and yes, your defense is better than advertised.
Your offense is horrid. Just horrid. When dollars and expectations are considered, your offense is a disaster.
You also react with stiffness when the clubhouse atmosphere is questioned.
You get hurt, albeit while hustling, and miss the last two months of the year.
Your new manager asks you to show up a little early for spring training.
You have been off since mid-summer, receiving huge checks, not rehabbing or traveling with the team—enjoying one of history’s longest high-paid vacations.
What do you do?
Do you say “Skip, I will be there; I am eager to show the fans, my teammates, and management that 2010 was a fluke!”
Or do you decide to wait until the last possible moment to show up? And continue striking out.
I was on his side last year, but if he sucks again, I might even boo, and I rarely ever boo a Met.
He should have been in camp before even Wright.
Who remains the epitome of class and effort.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:43am at 9:43 am (UTC -4)
Well.. Wright’s not really doing well either. I can’t blame the guy for not attending a voluntary workout (or is it even a workout or just people gathering up early?)
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-9:44am at 9:44 am (UTC -4)
I’m not going to comment about whether Bay was asked or should have should up early. I didn’t see much on that.
However, I did read Bay’s interview recently describing second half of last year after that concussion. He said it was horrible. Headaches and dizziness non stop. Said for 2 months he couldn’t read, couldn’t use his smart phone, couldn’t watch TV for more than 5 minutes w/o it starting. Driving was out. Said all he could do was lie around and it was frustrating. Everything but his head felt fine but ‘I couldn’t do ANYTHING’.
He said gradually, the intensity of the headaches diminished and he could read for a few minutes at a time.
I got the impression that injury imposed ‘vacation’ was not fun.
TRS86
3/16/2011-9:47am at 9:47 am (UTC -4)
True and flying across country for one day and then flying back to me is an unnecessary test of that condition.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-9:16am at 9:16 am (UTC -4)
I think Bay is all done.
And I think he should have been the very first one in camp when Collins asked.
He may deserve some boos this year if he continues to suck royally.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-9:20am at 9:20 am (UTC -4)
I’m not one for booing my team, but if I was at the games there is no way I could ever applaud anything Ollie did.
Watching these ST games though has anyone else noticed that Bay is the only one wearing sun glasses up at bat? I can’t help but wonder if he’s still feeling the effects of the concussion or if it’s just some precautionary measures.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-9:27am at 9:27 am (UTC -4)
Agreed totally on the booing.
After Ollie showed up to camp in 2009 out of shape, he was fair game, and after refusing to go to the minors last year, he deserved to be screamed at every time he showed his face.
TRS86
3/16/2011-9:33am at 9:33 am (UTC -4)
“Bay said he will consider attending mini-camp in Port St. Lucie, Fla., next month. New manager Terry Collins has asked him if he wanted to go. But Bay lives in Seattle, and may opt to skip the trip due to the distance.”
Andy McCullough/The Star-Ledger December 14th.
So which is it? Did Terry Collins say you need to be there or ask him if he wanted to go?
TRS86
3/16/2011-9:38am at 9:38 am (UTC -4)
Also based on what I am reading, minicamp is VERY mini. In fact, it’s one day. Him flying to minicamp working one day and flying back does not seem very logical when he could continue his own workouts in Seattle.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-9:52am at 9:52 am (UTC -4)
Well, to your first question, I say what in the world is the difference? You just got paid $15 million for three months of rotten production–be there.
As to the second question, I think it is 2-3 days at least, but I am not sure.
No way it can be just one day; that would make zero sense.
TRS86
3/16/2011-10:03am at 10:03 am (UTC -4)
It is “3″ days. One day actually “on the field” and two travel/media days. No real instruction from what I am reading, only a few drills to see “if you are ready for ST”.
From what I am reading even that is a stretch now. It’s mostly a meet and greet media event.
Also as to my first question to me that’s a huge deal. Could have been….
“Hey Jason, you coming to minicam?”
“I am thinking about it Terry.”
“OK well look forward to talking to you. Later.”
“Later”
Asked him to go and asked him if he wanted to go are two very different things.
Also, what we don’t know is if Sandy and the medical guys told Bay to stay in Seattle and continue your normal workouts instead of flying across country 2 times in 3 days.
Again to me it’s not a story. In fact we really did not hear anymore about it from Terry or Bay.
kistics
3/16/2011-10:07am at 10:07 am (UTC -4)
Bay’s struggles at the plate, IMO, has nothing to do with attending the mini camp. But it’s more about the swing change. And the swing change was probably implemented by the new hitting coach when they first got together in ST. So, it’s only natural to struggle with your timing right now. But I just hope that he picks it up soon rather than later.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-10:53am at 10:53 am (UTC -4)
I definitely did not say that the struggles have anything to do with minicamp.
I personally would have liked to see Bay show that he is willing to give a little extra after what he gave the team last year, on and off the field.
TRS86
3/16/2011-11:32am at 11:32 am (UTC -4)
Do we even know if the Mets wanted to travel there for minicamp? Again not sure this is much of an issue. If he showed up late for ST I think that would have been more of an issue.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-9:12am at 9:12 am (UTC -4)
I think Wright typically has a slow start to his seasons – except last year for some reason. So I’m not worried….yet.
Bay, on the other hand, could be a problem. Chris Carlin, who was down in PSL yesterday, did an update for Loud Mouths last night. He’s impressed with Bay, says he’ll have a bounce back year hitting at least 30 HRs and 110 RBIs. Here’s hoping…..
kistics
3/16/2011-9:20am at 9:20 am (UTC -4)
I haven’t seen anything out of Bay to be impressed…
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-9:09am at 9:09 am (UTC -4)
On another note, saw this interview with aspiring teen announcer Lenore Luca on You Tube, by way of MMO:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpjpLHNxkuw
First, she’s very poised as interviewer for one so young. Bright future ahead of her.
She interviewed Ron Darling. When asked:
I had asked Ron Darling if he thinks Terry Collins, the new Mets Manager, will bring his team to a winning season and all Ron could say while laughing was “Yeah, good luck Terry.”
***********
Yikes….guess Ron doesn’t see a playoff berth in the Mets future for 2011. He did go on to say though they’ve got some talented pieces and he’s rooting for them to win 100 games.
The funniest comment though was when Lenore asked him what it’s like working with fellow ’86 teammate Keith Hernandez. Ronnie says:
‘The best reality show never made, is Keith and I in between innings.
I can just imagine, knowing the ‘comedy’ Keith brings to the booth on the air.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-9:14am at 9:14 am (UTC -4)
Ron’s right on the money and his honesty is a breath of fresh air.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:09am at 9:09 am (UTC -4)
Is Igarashi out of the picture for good?
wannybackstra
3/16/2011-9:12am at 9:12 am (UTC -4)
No. He can be sent to AAA. He’s already cleared waivers.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-9:16am at 9:16 am (UTC -4)
Was it a renegotiated contract or do they still owe him the original 2 year ML contract he got in 2010?
kistics
3/16/2011-9:19am at 9:19 am (UTC -4)
I believe they still owe him whatever he signed for.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-9:21am at 9:21 am (UTC -4)
That explains then why he cleared waivers with no problem.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:19am at 9:19 am (UTC -4)
Yeah but he’s not going to be on the 25 man roster anytime soon.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-9:15am at 9:15 am (UTC -4)
Rusty, let me say that I sincerely hope that the use of these vintage rock themes is something I hope will continue!
ajgmets
3/16/2011-1:26pm at 1:26 pm (UTC -4)
Thought you were a “MetalHead” Ed!! What’s with The Who..? (Hu!) ..Looking forward to your next take on Perez future as an employee of Shake Shack B 52′s style
Ollie’s Scoopin’ and Mixin’, dancin’ and a lovin’,
All that money he’s a countin’ Now he’s got next to nothing,
Hitters he’s a walkin’.. Cuz he throws eighty somethin’
The Shake Shack shimmies
Ollie is a movin’ around and around and around!
Everybody’s moanin’, everybody’s groanin’ baby!
Folks linin’ up just to suck a shake down
Everybody’s cryin’, Met Fans are Dyin’ baby
Funked Up Shake shack! Funky Shake shack!
Bang Bang on the door Terry
Bang Bang on the Floor Omar
Bang Bang
You’re What?
No Good!! ….Busted…
You want Fries Wit Dat?
.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:22am at 9:22 am (UTC -4)
Does anyone know a good fantasy baseball analysis site?
TRS86
3/16/2011-9:30am at 9:30 am (UTC -4)
To analysis what?
kistics
3/16/2011-9:39am at 9:39 am (UTC -4)
I’m just looking for a good informative site outside of Yahoo or ESPN.
TRS86
3/16/2011-9:49am at 9:49 am (UTC -4)
Why I am asking is it depends on what kind of stats you are looking for.
If you are looking for LOTS of general stats and splits then http://www.baseballreference.com is incredible.
If you are looking for more modern stats and more ability to compare those stats to other players then http://www.fangraphs.com is your best bet. Just don’t read the articles…. LOL.
kistics
3/16/2011-9:51am at 9:51 am (UTC -4)
I meant for Fantasy Baseball…
TRS86
3/16/2011-10:07am at 10:07 am (UTC -4)
http://www.thebaseballcube.com used to be decent.
kistics
3/16/2011-10:34am at 10:34 am (UTC -4)
Thanks.
saltygary
3/16/2011-10:18am at 10:18 am (UTC -4)
Excel… CBS Sports Makes it easy to capture the data that you need. Copy it and dump it into excel and build formula’s around what scoring format you need.
For the TRD yahoo league just look at adding multiple categories together to see who had the most impact. For me I had a real difficult time with the yahoo format last year. There were a couple categories that are based on luck that had such an impact on the final weekly results that in the end threw everything else out the window.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-10:09am at 10:09 am (UTC -4)
Ha! Guess who won MMO’s second contest:
http://metsmerizedonline.com/2011/03/contest-update-162-0-imagine-a-mets-perfect-season-were-giving-away-5-free-copies.html
ajgmets
3/16/2011-1:39pm at 1:39 pm (UTC -4)
I thought last week was a trivia contest .. and They said I got the 1st All Star voted question wrong when I answered in this manner .. 1. Bud Harrelson was the 1st Mets player actually VOTED to start by the fans in 1971, the second season that the selection of starters was returned to fan voting after being taken away after 1957. Several Mets had been elected(by the players, managers and coaches during the void in fan voting eras) as starters earlier including Ron Hunt (1964), Jerry Grote(1968}. Pitchers obviously have been selected by managers
saltygary
3/16/2011-10:20am at 10:20 am (UTC -4)
Speaking of fantasy did you MF4D sign up? There are an odd number of teams and we need one more brave soul.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-10:33am at 10:33 am (UTC -4)
No, I wasn’t brave enough this year. As much as I follow baseball, I honestly don’t have a clue about fantasy baseball. I guess I need that ‘Fantasy Baseball Guide for Dummies’ version….LOL.
kistics
3/16/2011-10:37am at 10:37 am (UTC -4)
You should just give it a try. We all suck at it, but pretend as if we know it.
saltygary
3/16/2011-10:58am at 10:58 am (UTC -4)
I think this is the safest environment to give it a shot. There is no money on the line and you are amongst friends…
TRS86
3/16/2011-11:34am at 11:34 am (UTC -4)
I will be soon. Just have not had the time yet.
TRS86
3/16/2011-11:41am at 11:41 am (UTC -4)
OK accepted invite.
oleosmirf
3/16/2011-10:46am at 10:46 am (UTC -4)
From the games I’ve watched, Bay doesn’t look like someone who can hit more than 20 HR. The guy just has no lift on his ball at all…
kistics
3/16/2011-10:57am at 10:57 am (UTC -4)
What’s the percentage Beltran starts the season on DL.
I would say 96.785%.
saltygary
3/16/2011-11:00am at 11:00 am (UTC -4)
I have a felling they are going to wheel his old bones out for the first week and then real him back in. The last headline they want is that Beltran can’t make opening day, but this is going to be a story all season no matter what. If we can’t have a healthy Beltran I would much rather have a kid in there.
kistics
3/16/2011-11:08am at 11:08 am (UTC -4)
I don’t know if the new regime would pull a move like that. I think it’s best to put him on DL (sooner than later) and make sure he’s healthy before playing in the majors.
stickguy
3/16/2011-11:12am at 11:12 am (UTC -4)
at this point, there is nothing to save him for. Might as well roll him out, and see how long he lasts. if he can’t get on the field he is useless to the Mets, and untradeable.
Since he is a lame duck, just beat him like a rental mule and see what he can take!
stickguy
3/16/2011-11:10am at 11:10 am (UTC -4)
Oh Boy, Ollie and bay the topics of the morning!
Ollie does have to go. I will be mind boggled, not to mention mortified, fi they somehow justify putting him on the roster. There just can’t be a situation where he is realistically (contract aside) the BEST option for the last pen spot,
Besides, I still say no more OOGYs!
at the time, I was with TRS. Understood why they did the deal, figured it was a little high but ball park for a FA #3 SP, but preferred they offered arb, hope he walked, took the picks and signed someone like Wolf for less.
to be fair, even the people that did not want him never expected this total train wreck (more like a couple of extra years of up and down).
Bay? Well, I am on record saying that I would trade him for anything right now to get rid of him. At least 3 seasons left (including 2011), and possibly 4? Ouch. And with about 5 interesting hitting prospects that all seem destined for LF, compound fracture ouch!
He just looks old, and shot. And the concussion effects aren’t going to help reverse that. As much as I would love to see a rebound, there are no signs of it yet.
$.50 on the dollar? Try $.10 and he is yours! If he spends the first few months of this season with no HRs, a Castillo-esue slugging %, and striking out at a Wright like rate, the Boos are going to be fierce.
tangent, but I notice elsewhere (MMO) there is a big revisionist history debate going on about Omar, now that some of his prospects are making an impact. Well, that is wonderful, but looking at the big $ roster he put on the field (Bay, Castillo, Ollie, not to mention the previous duds) that all means nothing in terms of damage to the team!
kingman 26
3/16/2011-11:26am at 11:26 am (UTC -4)
Yeah, at this point (while I won’t visit that silly place) I have to agree that the Omar Era must be labeled a disaster.
Even if all of the kids become stars, we are saddled with Johan and Bay for several more years at nearly 40 mil/per.
We have Beltran for another 18 mil, and the daily nonsense surrounding Ollie and Slappy (another $18 million!)
So, if Omar’s kids develop well this year, imagine what the team might have been able to do this offseason and during the year if so many tens of millions were not invested in aging/non-productive/injury-prone/declining players.
TRS86
3/16/2011-11:35am at 11:35 am (UTC -4)
You saying he should not have signed Johan?
stickguy
3/16/2011-11:40am at 11:40 am (UTC -4)
Johan was a risk they needed to take at the time (though if you could find the MB archives, I warned you all!).
Ditto for Beltran. Those are defendable.
It is pumping huge $$ into already old guys, or ones that were just not that good to start with, and expecting peak years in their mid-30s that was Omar’s downfall.
TRS86
3/16/2011-11:44am at 11:44 am (UTC -4)
Right but even Ollie, as much as I did not want it to happen, it was widely supported in the baseball world. Really the only damning contract was the one to Castillo. That one seemed like at the time and still is a bad contract. Small ones to guys like Julio Franco or Tim Redding? Every GM has idiot moments like those.
I think Omar’s greatest failure is that he … failed. Not for one single reason, not that his farm-system was terrible or Ollie and Castillo stunk or Beltran got injured. Omar’s tenure was a failure because he failed to get it done and was fired for that failure. Sometimes we try and break it down too much.
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:32pm at 12:32 pm (UTC -4)
In the post-OEDs era, that deal to Bay was a stupid ass idea too. Very little chance he was every going to earn the money, but pretty good chance he would be tailing off.
TRS86
3/16/2011-12:33pm at 12:33 pm (UTC -4)
Not THAT sharply though. Still remains to be seen if last year was a fluke or sign to come.
saltygary
3/16/2011-12:46pm at 12:46 pm (UTC -4)
There is a term that my wife and I use, it’s called “last minute grooming”. When baboons are about to choose a new leader the current leader runs around like a nut and grooms the other baboon’s backs of bugs and dirt. It’s kind of a campaign tactic.
Bay’s contract was last minute grooming. He threw crap at the wall and hopes it will stick. He had no more ideas just money.
I was extremely happy that Bay signed with the team he is a nice player but the money was crazy. He has no leadership qualities just goes out and does his job which only works if you can do your job well.
I am very anxious about Bay and want to see him play outside spring to get a gauge before making any kind of judgment. The one think that keeps sticking in my brain is how quickly Boston let him go. He had a great season with Boston and they must of saw something they did not like.
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:50pm at 12:50 pm (UTC -4)
Boston is know for being smart about letting guys go 1 year early vs. a few year too late, and getting picks out of the deal!
saltygary
3/16/2011-12:52pm at 12:52 pm (UTC -4)
Exactly.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-1:23pm at 1:23 pm (UTC -4)
Salty, I am starting to think that you have somehow managed to wiretap my thoughts.
Boston has made exactly how many wrong moves the last 7–8 years? They had ZERO interest in Bay at that price and duration.
Leadership? I do remember him crying when the team’s leadership and clubhouse habits were questioned.
saltygary
3/16/2011-12:38pm at 12:38 pm (UTC -4)
Omar’s biggest failures were no accountability, poor management of high priced contracts and a poor farm system.
I was on the side of the Ollie trade and he didn’t get killed on it. Oliie was the second best choice that year and the money Lowe signed was crazy. This was a devil you know devil you don’t situation and like always the devil threw a monkey wrench in the mix.
The Castillo was BADDDDD. Folks were flat out confused on that one.
Santana was the trade of the century and anyone taking him on would of had to sign that contract. If the Mets did anything on 07 and 08 it would probably be a non-issue right now. Teams like the Mets have the luxury of over-signing of aging players.
I don’t think anyone liked that tale end of Beltran’s contract but the team was in turmoil and Omar was essentially forced to bribe players to come. Again if the Mets had better results in 06-08 and if he didn’t K on one of the best curve balls I’ve ever seen it would probably be a non-issue.
TRS86
3/16/2011-12:42pm at 12:42 pm (UTC -4)
While all of those things are true, again we are over analyzing. Omar was a failure because he failed. Plain and simple. If we had won a WS during that time or even made it to the WS then perhaps even with all those marks against him it would have still been a success. However, we did not and thus he failed.
saltygary
3/16/2011-12:52pm at 12:52 pm (UTC -4)
Isn’t that why we are here to over analyze? I don’t think we in this thread there is just 6 years worth of material to judge and a lot of easy things to look at.
In the end he failed because the team failed. He did his part and gave that team almost every opportunity to win and they choked. The managers choked and so did the players. If you want to over analyze then you can say things like Omar didn’t do enough to shore up the bullpen in 07-08 where I think he did what he could and there weren’t many options.
kingman 26
3/16/2011-1:21pm at 1:21 pm (UTC -4)
At the time I loved the trade.
Today?
It’s exhibit A of why you don’t every sign a pitcher to a 6-year deal, let alone for $130+ million.
stickguy
3/16/2011-11:38am at 11:38 am (UTC -4)
Sadly, this could have come out under a “real” sources by line, and no one would blink!
http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/articles/carlos-beltran-has-impressive-day-of-not-falling-a,19690/
saltygary
3/16/2011-12:54pm at 12:54 pm (UTC -4)
Ouch. If that doesn’t take off ones rose colored glasses about Beltran I don’t know what does.
Mr North Jersey
3/16/2011-12:00pm at 12:00 pm (UTC -4)
so I see Beltran took batting practice today but not from the left side. If Beltran is not playing RF by Sunday I would think Beltran starting the year again on the DL is almost a definite.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-12:05pm at 12:05 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed. I’d bet on it at this point.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-12:12pm at 12:12 pm (UTC -4)
Toby Hyde’s take on second base:
http://www.metsminorleagueblog.com/on-luis-hernandez-and-what-mles-tell-us-about-the-2b-competition/
Along with stats to back up his opinion he says:
My Solution
If putting the best roster together for Opening Day were the only thing that mattered, I’d take Turner and Murphy and let Chin-lung Hu sub for both late in games defensively. Both Turner and Murphy can play multiple positions, even if they’re not great anywhere. It would actually produce some really interesting tactical options.
If maximizing the total talent in the organization is more the goal (rather than making the playoffs in 2011) it could well make more sense to keep Emaus, who would have to be offered back to the Jays if he doesn’t make the Opening Day roster. Given that, they could use the first few months of the season to find out if he’s worth keeping. I think this is the likeliest scenario, with Turner, who still has options, dispatched back to the farm and Murphy and Emaus in a semi-platoon. If Emaus is an asset, so much the better.
I’d release Castillo. He won’t be a Met after this year. It’s time to figure out who can contribute to the next Mets playoff team
Mr North Jersey
3/16/2011-12:16pm at 12:16 pm (UTC -4)
I’ll take curtain #4 please.
oleosmirf
3/16/2011-12:32pm at 12:32 pm (UTC -4)
personally I’m of the Emaus/Murphy LH/RH platoon but given the results so far this spring, Castillo’s won the job by a landslide.
While Castillo brings stability, I don’t the Mets can win unless we get a Jose Valentin type performance for our #7 hitter. With all those guys in front of him, our 7 and 8 hitters are going to get a ton of RBI chances and Murphy gives us the best chance of winning in that regard b/c of his ability to drive in runs…
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:38pm at 12:38 pm (UTC -4)
I think Castillos comfortable mediocrity gets confused with stability. He can make plays around the bag, assuming he actually gets there in time. Overall, he might “look” like a 2B still, but it is largely a shell.
and offensively, he does not deserve to be put into a lineup.
I still say that if he is the “winner” because the other contestants sucked, then they need to find some more contestants!
Castillo defines the term “no upside”. At best, slim chance he approaches mediocre. I can’t see him though being better than below average.
If he isn’t he worst 2B in all of MLB this year, it will be a damned close race. And since he is gone soon anyway, just move on please!
TRS86
3/16/2011-12:32pm at 12:32 pm (UTC -4)
I am in complete agreement with Toby here. Keep Emaus and Murphy as the 2B. They will not be great but that’s fine. Lets see what we have then make adj. Maybe by June Tejada, Valdespin or Havens will be ready.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-12:45pm at 12:45 pm (UTC -4)
Me too. Castillo’s time has come and gone on this team. He needs to be released.
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:34pm at 12:34 pm (UTC -4)
Dang MF, did not see you already posted this!
my opinion? I have been supporting the turner as the RH batter in a platoon option for a while now. Guy really rakes lefties (OPS last year of 1.00+ vs. LHP).
I would bet on Turner putting up better numbers, and just as good D, than Emaus.
But, I could support giving Emaus a shot if they think he has potential.
The real given is that Castillo has to go!
So, give Emaus/Murphy a month to see how everyone is doing, then adjust. If either (or both) of them aren’t cutting it, replace them. By then, havens might be racing up the depth chart, Turner could be having a big year, etc.
Or of course, the ML guys could be working out!
But certainly, based on upside potential and looking to the future, it can’t be Castillo playing.
oleosmirf
3/16/2011-12:36pm at 12:36 pm (UTC -4)
considering Turner has options it makes sense to give Emaus the nod first and if he is struggling then try Turner with Hu as the late game defensive replacement.
TRS86
3/16/2011-12:37pm at 12:37 pm (UTC -4)
Yup.
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:40pm at 12:40 pm (UTC -4)
The option for Turner is the only reason I would support going with Emaus instead, so they can keep them both.
TRS86
3/16/2011-12:44pm at 12:44 pm (UTC -4)
Well that and Turner is not exactly tearing it up this spring either and looking at stats in the minors they are very similar.
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-12:46pm at 12:46 pm (UTC -4)
Ha! no problem.
And we seem to all be in agreement with Toby on this.
kistics
3/16/2011-12:49pm at 12:49 pm (UTC -4)
Great analysis by Toby. He pretty much sums up what all of us are saying in a very organized fashion.
ajgmets
3/16/2011-1:41pm at 1:41 pm (UTC -4)
Roster flexibility is the Mets issue. So with turner having more options left than any of the others he will be sent down..
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:30pm at 12:30 pm (UTC -4)
Very nice summary by Toby about the 2B situation. Hard to argue with his logic, but you can certainly debate the other guy that thinks there won’t be many GBs!
http://www.metsminorleagueblog.com/on-luis-hernandez-and-what-mles-tell-us-about-the-2b-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-9254
oleosmirf
3/16/2011-12:34pm at 12:34 pm (UTC -4)
I think predicting the GB rates is pretty much impossible. What is easy to predict is the need for a good hitter in the 7 hole. Our 3-6 hitters have high OBP so our bottom of the order is going to have lots of RBI opportunities and Murphy, Thole is going to generate a heck of a lot more runs than Thole, Castillo/Hernandez
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:39pm at 12:39 pm (UTC -4)
I agree. enough of the black hole bottom 3 please. Not having a dead spot in the order for a change will be nice.
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:43pm at 12:43 pm (UTC -4)
There is actually 1 more option that hasn’t been mentioned for 2B (using the available players).
If they think Castillo can still play, platoon him and murphy. As bad a hitter as Castillo is, he is less bad vs. LHP. And at least Murphy would get the bulk of the PT.
I know that Slappy on the bench is pretty much worthless, but hell, it is still better than seeing him start every day!
scratch that, just cut his sorry ass.
TRS86
3/16/2011-12:45pm at 12:45 pm (UTC -4)
Can’t have Slappy on the team unless he is the starting 2B. His attitude would seem to not allow that, also kills the bench.
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:48pm at 12:48 pm (UTC -4)
I agree. Just wonder what the FO thinks though. And platooning is a little different, since you are “sort of” a starter!
I found it amusing (well, depressing) that Castillo actually had the balls to come out and tell Collins that he wanted to be released if he was not named starter. Well, F U buddy, after all the money he stole from the Mets, if they want him to sit on the bench, sit down and shut up. Or retire, and forfeit his guaranteed salary, then he can go anywhere!
stickguy
3/16/2011-12:46pm at 12:46 pm (UTC -4)
Another thought. Since obviously no one is stepping up to claim the job (and I still consider Castillo to be nothing more than an emergency fall back for the team), maybe they are stringing it along (keeping Luis) waiting to see if anyone decent gets cut late in ST.
I mentioned josh Barfield before. 2B, 27ish, former top prospect, slowed by injuries the last few years but having a big camp. Might not make the phils (though with utley out, he probably does).
If not him, maybe another viable option pops up before the season starts?
metsfan4decades
3/16/2011-12:48pm at 12:48 pm (UTC -4)
Maybe, but it’s just as likely other clubs that might need a second string type 2nd baseman will just wait out Alderson on him releasing Castillo. That way, they pick him up on our dime and only have to pay him league minimum.
kistics
3/16/2011-1:06pm at 1:06 pm (UTC -4)
Here are the ST stats. Tell me how Hernandez is getting ANY attention at 2B.
Castillo 8 G/ 8GS, 40.0 Innings, 25AB, .280/.357/.280, 7 hits, 0 doubles, 2 RBI
Murphy 6G/ 5GS, 37.0 Innings, 34AB .324/.343/.500, 11 hits, 6 Doubles, 7 RBI
Emaus 8G/ 4GS, 36.0 Innings 21AB, .190/.292.190, 4 hits, 0 doubles, 0 RBI
Turner 5G/ 2GS, 18.0 Innings 25AB, .200./.231/.240 5 hits, 1 double, 2 RBI
Hernandez (at SS) 6G/ 1GS, 24.0 Innings, 13AB, .385/.429/.538, 5 hits, 1 triple, 2 RBI
Hernandez’ high offensive numbers are because of ONE triple and ONE walk…. Oh BTW, did you know that in this ST, Hernandez has logged ZERO innings at 2B?
A word to Puma… if you are going to lie, lie about something that makes sense…
kingman 26
3/16/2011-1:25pm at 1:25 pm (UTC -4)
Are they auditioning Hernandez for SS while trying to move Jose?
I am sure Rubin and Klapisch know….
Emaus I think is a zero.
ajgmets
3/16/2011-1:48pm at 1:48 pm (UTC -4)
Emaus as Ricciardi’s pet project will more than likely be kept..Why not ?.. It’s not as if we fans have any real “hatred” or disdain for this kid who’s put up above avg minor’s #s..I say give him a chance..at least we’ll know he’s got to work hard to show JP he was worthy.
stickguy
3/16/2011-1:57pm at 1:57 pm (UTC -4)
If he continues to play like this, wait a couple weeks into the season, and offer him back to the Jays and they probably decline anyway.