In this evenings action the 3-4 Mets fell to the 3-4 Nationals 6-2.
First inning saw the Mets leave runners in scoring position in what seems to be a reoccurring trend. Jose singled and moved up to second on a wild pitch only to be stranded there after a strike out and 2 line outs.
With 2 outs in the second inning the Nats got something going. A single to Rick Ankiel followed by an uncharacteristic 2 walks from Dickey loaded the bases. Luckily with two outs, the pitcher was up. However in his best Chris Young impersonation, Jordan Zimmerman singled in two. Pudge was out on the play trying to make sure the 2nd runner scored. Score 0-2.
Top of the third inning we saw Wild Dickey again. After getting 2 outs Dickey walked the next two batters giving him four for the game. Luckily he was able to retire the next hitter on a ground out to Jose Reyes.
Bottom of the fourth inning saw a lead off double (3rd of the year) from David Wright, a ground out from Beltran moving Wright to 3rd, and a sac fly from Davis to bring in Wright. Score 1-2.
Top of the fifth inning Dickey became very hittable giving up 3 straight one out singles. Following those singles Dickey walked the next batter (5th of the game) to force in a run. Looking like the game could be broken wide open Jose Reyes made an amazing dive was able to get up tag 2nd and throw to 1st for an incredible inning ending double play. Score 1-3.
With one out in the bottom of the 5th Baby Met Josh Thole singled to LF. Following Thole was PH Baby Met Lucas Duda who doubled to RF to plate Thole. Unfortunately Duda was stranded at 2B. Score 2-3.
Bottom of the 6th with one out Beltran doubled over the head of CF Ankiel only to again be stranded at 2B.
Bottom of the 7th inning the Mets got 2 straight walks to put runners on 1st and 2nd. Hu PH for Carrasco laying down a perfect bunt to send Thole and Emaus to 2nd and 3rd with Reyes and Pagan coming up. Strike out, soft roller.
Top of the 8th inning Tim Byrdak came in to get Adam LaRoche swinging, walked Morse the RH, and then gave up a single to the LH Ankiel. Collins called on Parnell to get out of the inning. Parnell promptly walked the first batter to load the bases. Then with one out gave up a 2 RBI single to Pudge. Following a walk to PH Matt Stairs, Parnell gave up a scoring ground out to Ian Desmond. With 2 outs Collins stuck with Parnell who struck out Werth to end the inning. Score 2-6.
Bottom of the ninth produced only a 2 out single from Josh Thole. Daniel Muprhy grounded out to SS to end the game.
Tomorrow’s game 7:10 PM.
77 comments
hazmet
4/8/2011-8:29pm at 8:29 pm (UTC -4)
Collins post game on WFAN feed I heard said that Dickey had a split nail on his pitching hand in the 2nd inning. Not the best think for any pitcher let alone a knuckler. At least that explains somethings. Very discouraged at the moment. Starter’s not going long, Bullpen pitching like it’s BP, guys trying to hit 5 run HR’s. Counting on Capuano tomorrow, not an easy feeling about that given we’ll need length and quality coming from one of the rebound boys.
stickguy
4/8/2011-9:35pm at 9:35 pm (UTC -4)
I hope they haven’t abandoned the patient, intelligent plan at the plate and gone back to panicked hacking at all times (aka the jerry/hojo approach).
Ceetar
4/8/2011-9:53pm at 9:53 pm (UTC -4)
the bit I heard, Collins was critical of their approach at certain points in the game, and of all the walks “It will be addressed”
accountability? that’s a new one.
Yeah, Dickey split his nail in the first or something. knuckled through it. supposedly won’t be a problem in 5 days.
stickguy
4/8/2011-9:41pm at 9:41 pm (UTC -4)
If these expect me to be the other optimist (always good to have 2) they better get their shat together and quick, or this season will officially be over (as opposed to just looking like it may never start).
metsfan4decades
4/8/2011-9:57pm at 9:57 pm (UTC -4)
Dickey said he didn’t know how that split nail would affect him until he went back out in the 2nd. Quickly found out. He had filed it down as much as he could.
TC said he asked him about it after the first but Dickey assured him he could go back out. TC was impressed with that attitude.
Man these starters better ‘start’ getting into the 7th. Our questionable BP is exposed already.
WIsh that offense would consistently starting getting that big hit.
And hey….how about that Manny?
stickguy
4/8/2011-10:07pm at 10:07 pm (UTC -4)
what a dope.
but, funny.
and in the “silver lining” department (or is it the “still early” one), hughes got smoked again (pelfed?) and only lasted 2, and Lee was also pelfed lasting 3.1 and giving up 6 runs/10 hits. Lackey was pretty bad again. Lee has a 7+ era, and the others around 15!
Ceetar
4/8/2011-10:26pm at 10:26 pm (UTC -4)
Hughes has lost velocity. I heard someone say he was throwing 85-86. Maybe not ‘pelfed’ but ‘ollied’
stickguy
4/8/2011-10:28pm at 10:28 pm (UTC -4)
if he dropped close to 10mph, there must be an injury going on. No one loses that much, that quick at 25 without a real reason. Even Ollie didn’t do that.
kistics
4/8/2011-10:33pm at 10:33 pm (UTC -4)
John Maine anyone?
Ceetar
4/8/2011-10:36pm at 10:36 pm (UTC -4)
both Maine and Perez were because of injury, which could mean Hughes is hiding something.
TRS86
4/8/2011-11:03pm at 11:03 pm (UTC -4)
Still think Perez was due to injury? Either mechanics or injury to his “pharmacist”
stickguy
4/8/2011-11:20pm at 11:20 pm (UTC -4)
perez was also a more gradual decline. 1-2 mph in a year, with only the last one maybe 3. Not something like 10 at one shot.
kistics
4/8/2011-11:22pm at 11:22 pm (UTC -4)
Injury to his head.
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:27pm at 10:27 pm (UTC -4)
Manny adding tarnish to those 2 Boston Roid Sox championships. Then again I guess they knew better as they’ve got 2 rings in the last 10 years and history will just brush over it as a sign of the times for the steroid era.
stickguy
4/8/2011-10:29pm at 10:29 pm (UTC -4)
fans don’t care. they just remember the titles.
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:31pm at 10:31 pm (UTC -4)
exactly, and if it was me I would too.
kistics
4/8/2011-10:35pm at 10:35 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t see him getting in the HOF. He has put up great numbers, but with 2 PED busts, who’s to say that he was not juicing his entire career? He’s no different than Sosa.
Ceetar
4/8/2011-10:37pm at 10:37 pm (UTC -4)
Or Bagwell.
wait, sometimes seems wrong there..
TRS86
4/8/2011-10:37pm at 10:37 pm (UTC -4)
Well, other than being a much better hitter and actually winning a championship.
kistics
4/8/2011-11:19pm at 11:19 pm (UTC -4)
What I meant to say was that like Sosa’s 600+ HRs doesn’t mean anything, Manny’s offensive numbers shouldn’t mean anything. Or at least should be looked at differently.
rustyjr
4/8/2011-10:08pm at 10:08 pm (UTC -4)
Btw what did Fred say on the fat mans show? I was at O.d
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:10pm at 10:10 pm (UTC -4)
Looking for meaningful games in April – j/k …
metsfan4decades
4/8/2011-10:14pm at 10:14 pm (UTC -4)
It’s linked her in an earlier post. I haven’t listened to it yet.
rustyjr
4/8/2011-10:19pm at 10:19 pm (UTC -4)
I really don’t want to listen to the fat man chortle and breath heavily so if someone can give me the Clift notes version I’d appreciate it
kistics
4/8/2011-10:16pm at 10:16 pm (UTC -4)
It’s so frustrating to watch when these pitchers can’t throw strikes and these hitters can’t get the timely hitting.
It’s was really poorly played game from pitching and offense.
Weather is supposed to warm up tomorrow.. so hopefully that would help.
I don’t think Jose has walked yet this season. I wish he would take a pitch once in awhile. It seems like when he gets really jumpy, he’ll swing at everything. He’s always been a free swinger, but try to take a pitch once in awhile.. geez..
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:24pm at 10:24 pm (UTC -4)
Thought the same thing when Jose came up with guys on 2nd & 3rd. It seemed like yak yak 2 strikes down. Wasn’t crazy about bunting the guys over in the 7th to play for the tie entering the last third of the game.
kistics
4/8/2011-10:30pm at 10:30 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed about the bunting. But I can understand why with Murphy being not so fast.
When Jose came up to bat, I’m okay with him swinging at the first pitch. But the next 2 pitches were up and in and Jose should have taken those pitches. Yet he seemed to be too jumpy. And then you’re 0-2. Ugh…
And can Hairston just try to get a single before hitting a HR.. he’s leading off in the 9th with 4 down, he just tries to kill the ball and pops up.. Ugh…
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:36pm at 10:36 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah it was the second pitch to Jose that was up that he jumped at that got me. Hopefully, Terry can get them to calm down a little and get them back to what he’s been preaching.
TRS86
4/8/2011-10:39pm at 10:39 pm (UTC -4)
Yup, ultimately if Reyes is going to have an OBP of .325 or less then him not being here next year will have nothing to do with Met finances. I love Jose but damn embrace being a lead-off hitter and get the hell on base.
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:45pm at 10:45 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing earlier today even before the game and Jose’s my fav player on the team. Then he had a game with some of those maddening points. He gets on early today, gets in scoring position and they can’t get him in. He makes maybe the best defensive play of the Mets early season to turn that double play. Then goes on to get a jumpy impatient at bat with the 2 guys in scoring position. So much talent but just can drive me nuts. Must remember it’s only game 7….
stickguy
4/8/2011-11:00pm at 11:00 pm (UTC -4)
it gets late early these days.
Ceetar
4/8/2011-10:25pm at 10:25 pm (UTC -4)
he hasn’t, though I’ve seen him work counts to full and take pitches in key spots. He’s hitting well though, the real test will be when he doesn’t get pitches to hit, if he can work walks.
TRS86
4/8/2011-10:36pm at 10:36 pm (UTC -4)
NO NO NO. LOL. He has a .310 OBP. That is not doing anything well. Especially not for a lead-off hitter.
Ceetar
4/8/2011-10:37pm at 10:37 pm (UTC -4)
dropped today obviously, but he was hitting .340 or something. when the ball is fat and you’re hitting it for hits..*shrug*
TRS86
4/8/2011-10:43pm at 10:43 pm (UTC -4)
he was hitting .310 going into this game. Down to .303 now.
Even when he was hitting .340 Ceetar his OBP was .340. That’s just not good enough for a lead-off hitter, regardless if he is “hitting” well. He needs to understand he is a lead-off hitter and embrace his role. Period. Whined and complained about being moved from the lead-off spot because he is a lead-off hitter. Well then play like one. 0 walks in 34 ab’s from the lead-off position? Ridiculous. This is coming from a guy that likes Reyes but he’s got to get his crap together.
stickguy
4/8/2011-10:47pm at 10:47 pm (UTC -4)
i never did understand why he was so upset about moving down in the order. He approaches his ABs like a run producer (hacker?), so why not hit down where it can be useful, and no one would bug him about not walking.
TRS86
4/8/2011-10:55pm at 10:55 pm (UTC -4)
Agreed. To me he’s better off as a 5/6 hitter with the mental approach that he has. Yeah he’s fast but he has evidently no idea that there is a correlation in how well you can use that speed and getting the hell on base.
Last 636 PA he has 31 walks. LOL 31. 31. 31.
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-12:39am at 12:39 am (UTC -4)
So are we saying here is he either produce like a prototypical lead off hitter or he’s gone?
Is it he won’t be worth the $$ b/c of the leadoff spot?
Is he worth the money/years if he batted lower in the order?
Why does it have to be lead off or nothing?
stickguy
4/9/2011-7:32am at 7:32 am (UTC -4)
it shouldn’t be.
TRS86
4/9/2011-1:52pm at 1:52 pm (UTC -4)
Ask Reyes why it has to be lead-off or nothing. What I am saying is that he would have to increase his power numbers and bat lower in the order/ ask for less money/ learn to take a walk and do what it takes to get on base.
Ceetar
4/8/2011-10:53pm at 10:53 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t recall much whining, just saying he preferred leadoff.
My point was It’s just not his game, he’s not Luis Castillo. I don’t want him laying off pitches that he can hit to try to work a walk. It’s probably why he has problems with it. What i’ll be interested to see is when he’s not hitting well, if he can minimize the slump by being more patient and walking.
TRS86
4/8/2011-10:58pm at 10:58 pm (UTC -4)
If it’s not part of his game to work the count and take walks then move the hell off the lead off position. That’s a big part of the role.
Ceetar seriously, the last 636 PA he is walking at damn Bengie Molina rates.
TRS86
4/8/2011-11:06pm at 11:06 pm (UTC -4)
Frenchy has had more walks in less PA than Reyes has in the last year.
Ceetar
4/8/2011-11:13pm at 11:13 pm (UTC -4)
yes, but before last year he had four years of post .350 OBP. It’s 7 games in and he was seeing the ball well for most of it. Yes, he needs to walk a lot more, but he will.
TRS86
4/8/2011-11:25pm at 11:25 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, I want to believe that. However, it’s not just 7 games Ceetar. It’s 630+ PA with 31 walks.
There’s a lot of guys that have been “seeing the ball well”. David Wright for one. But that does not excuse a lead off hitter for going the first 33 PA without a walk.
kistics
4/8/2011-11:08pm at 11:08 pm (UTC -4)
I would not want him to lay off good pitches or be less aggressive (like Castillo). I really did not mind him hacking at the 1st pitch that Clippard threw. But what annoys me is that he just started to swing that stupid pitches like the next 2 that were clearly out of the strike zone. What I want is for him to lay off those stupid pitches while being aggressive when the timing is right.
TRS86
4/8/2011-11:26pm at 11:26 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah. That would be a good thing for sure. He has got to understand the situation in the game and what he needs to do to help the team score runs. Sometimes I am not sure he sees the big picture.
kistics
4/8/2011-10:54pm at 10:54 pm (UTC -4)
Unless he’s hitting .360 the whole season…
TRS86
4/8/2011-10:52pm at 10:52 pm (UTC -4)
Seriously leads the league if not then 2nd in PA and has 0 walks.
stickguy
4/8/2011-10:59pm at 10:59 pm (UTC -4)
trade him!
TRS86
4/8/2011-11:01pm at 11:01 pm (UTC -4)
If he is going to be the under .320 OBP Reyes then yeah he will be. I love Reyes and thought he had turned the corner and then last year happened. He forgot how to take a walk. This year I thought he would forget that Frenchy style of hacking and go back to what he had been working on. A new commitment to being a lead-off hitter. So far, 33 PA 0 frigging walks.
njstuckintx
4/9/2011-12:01am at 12:01 am (UTC -4)
Is that really the issue though? Based on the team, no, it’s completely the starting pitching, which we knew would be suspect at best going into this season. As for Reyes the player… yeah, he’s underwhelming at the moment. I don’t understand why he doesn’t take said walks, but it may also be mentioned that he’s only got 2 strikeouts in that time. He’s putting the ball in play. Matter of time before more start falling in for hits. (singing, always look on the bright side of life…)
TRS86
4/9/2011-1:51pm at 1:51 pm (UTC -4)
Bengie Molina did not strike out much either. You want him to bat lead-off and pay 18M a year? Again, to me it’s either he gets his OBP back up to the .355 area, ask for less money or moves on.
njstuckintx
4/9/2011-2:41pm at 2:41 pm (UTC -4)
Benji Molina couldn’t steal a base if his life depended on it and he didn’t play SS either.
kistics
4/8/2011-10:32pm at 10:32 pm (UTC -4)
Well.. Cliff Lee out after 3.1 IP 10 hits 6 ER…
2 of their Aces got rocked this week… GOOD!!!
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:34pm at 10:34 pm (UTC -4)
Since Ralph threw out the first pitch today I had to mention the oddest thing I saw on TV yesterday. Ralph Kiner doing a golf spot with Ben Hogan from some 1950′s show. Was strange, it was some religious channel I surfed by and he was being interviewed by a priest. All I could think of was him saying, “sorry father I gotta go now, couple of hollywood starlets I need to go schtoop….”
hazmet
4/8/2011-10:53pm at 10:53 pm (UTC -4)
Just saw Hanley Ramirez get his leg taken out on a late slide into second. Had to be carried off with 2 guys help. Didn’t look good for Hanley or the fish.
stickguy
4/8/2011-10:57pm at 10:57 pm (UTC -4)
leg contusion. day to day.
kistics
4/8/2011-11:14pm at 11:14 pm (UTC -4)
It just seems to me that Jose approaches the plate thinking “Okay I’m going to try to get on base anyway I can”. And then he takes couple pitches and it’s like 2-1 or something like that. But once he swings at a pitch, he can never lay the bat down. He’ll swing at everything once his mind set goes from taking pitches to “I only have 1 strike left in the count.”
TRS86
4/8/2011-11:27pm at 11:27 pm (UTC -4)
I don’t know, seems like I am still seeing a lot of outs via 1st or 2nd pitch pop ups.
stickguy
4/8/2011-11:33pm at 11:33 pm (UTC -4)
that’s why he doesn’t strike out that much.
njstuckintx
4/8/2011-11:55pm at 11:55 pm (UTC -4)
I will not succumb to overreaction-ism. Serenity Now! Serenity Now!
stickguy
4/9/2011-7:27am at 7:27 am (UTC -4)
Remain calm! Don’t Panic!
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-12:51am at 12:51 am (UTC -4)
Holy Cow….
I don’t know what is a bigger debate right now:
- Mets fans and what side of the base your on with resigning Reyes
or
- the debates going on right now with the federal budget.
(as yes as a Federal employee I’m watching CNN to find out if I’m laid off as of today.)
Here’s what I want to know – think I made a comment above:
Are we saying Reyes will not be worth the $$ unless he starts taking walks and raising his OBP to a respectable lead off hitter?
If his walks continue to not be good, but:
- will rarely Ks
- will bat around 285 (thereby getting on base via hits)
- does move runners along with either hits or productive outs
- doesn’t strand a ton of LOB ahead of him
- still has speed
- still has great range and that bullet for an arm then….
will he not still be worth the $$/years he will command?
njstuckintx
4/9/2011-1:48am at 1:48 am (UTC -4)
To me, he’s worth the money.
Will the Mets be able to go 7 years? no clue. That is the question, in my mind, as someone will. That’ll be the breaking point. Long term vs. Money spent. And I’m not sure the Mets, with their current ownership, have many luxuries in these things. Time will tell and here’s to hoping. re-sign reyes, even if he doesn’t walk all that much.
And as the whole “money not spent on Reyes can be spent to plug other holes” debate, what else out there can you use as hole filler? If you aren’t spending on Reyes, there is not much to spend on, unless you count on Pujols or someother pipe dream.
stickguy
4/9/2011-7:31am at 7:31 am (UTC -4)
they aren’t spending the money on another stud type. most will go to pay off debt, and some will go to a couple of mid level dudes (like Young). In essence, better filler parts.
Being a SS makes him more valuable. And no, he is not the prototypical lead off hitter, but that is because he probably should not be one.
the same way they dropped pagan to help run production, do the same thing with Reyes. Put him 6th, and let him hack away. Speed can be a weapon down there too!
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-9:40am at 9:40 am (UTC -4)
I guess I just don’t understand the debate of Reyes has to put up numbers indicative of a lead off hitter and if not, he’s gone.
njstuckintx
4/9/2011-9:55am at 9:55 am (UTC -4)
Me either. Stat-heads, please relax.
hazmet
4/9/2011-11:31am at 11:31 am (UTC -4)
So I guess you wouldn’t be interested in the Mets record when Jose draws at least 1 walk:
2010: 18-9
2009: 8-8 injury year (master of the obvious I am, in yoda voice)
2008: 33-23
2007: 41-24
So even when they were bad last year they were 9 games over .500 when he gets at least 1 walk. That’s a stat I can buy into and why it’s important he gets walks as a leadoff hitter or as any hitter. But, he is a leadoff hitter. Now if they can get their leadoff hitter in when he’s been doing his job to start the game it might help him press a little less later in the game. Wonder if he’s trying to do to much by maybe thinking “my mates couldn’t get me in so I’m going to not let anything pass to try to pick these runs up.” Let’s get back to .500 today. Although Grozelany’s been good against the Metsies, should be interesting.
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-11:46am at 11:46 am (UTC -4)
I think any win/loss record is going to look better when X player gets at least one walk a game.
I’m not disagreeing with the premise of Reyes needs to get on base. That’s a no brainer for a lead off hitter. And I think those walks will come (well, I hope they will).
I’m just questioning why it seems to be an all or nothing debate. Aren’t his other talents worth a flyer? Or is it going to boil down to wanting more $$ and/or years than what seem to think that talent is worth?
No matter if he turns it around this year with more patience at the plate, more walks and/or high OBP, I think we all know he’s going to have his pick of teams who are willing to pay. (as long as he stays healthy this year).
TRS86
4/9/2011-1:48pm at 1:48 pm (UTC -4)
Problem is 4D flyers don’t cost 18M/7 years. IF the Mets are going to re-sign him I think he has to get back to that .355 OBP guy to be worth it. Hitting .280 with only a .320 OBP for 18M just is not going to happen. Regardless of defense or speed. I love Reyes but I am concerned about his lack of walks and seemingly lack of effort to work on what he was basically told to work on.
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-2:57pm at 2:57 pm (UTC -4)
I hear you but I’m willing to bet they’ll be teams that will ‘overpay’ for the type of player he is. And that will be the reason we lose him. Not b/c Sandy won’t want to keep as much as he won’t want to overpay in $$ and/or years.
And since Reyes is probably no different than any other ballplayer, I can’t see him giving the home-town-type discount it’s going to take to resign him.
I’m not going to be happy seeing him in Yankee pinstripes or Philly red…..
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-2:59pm at 2:59 pm (UTC -4)
BTW, I responded to your email from yesterday. Sorry…just saw it now.
TRS86
4/9/2011-1:49pm at 1:49 pm (UTC -4)
It’s not about stat heads or not stat heads. Plain and simple if he is not getting on base more than .320 then he physically can’t be worth 18M for 7 years.
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-1:04am at 1:04 am (UTC -4)
Also, I’d like to see a post/debate about Citi Field itself.
-How many fans feel the dimensions are a huge problem? not a problem?
-Should the fences be lowered in the OF?
-Should they go once step further and bring in the fences?
-Will this detract from power/HR hitting FA from signing here?
-If the dimensions of the ball park really are a problem, how long until they can change up the culture/mindset of this team to take significant advantage of our home field instead of it being a detriment (i.e. gap hitters instead of line drive/HR hitters)?
Is any of this really a problem?
stickguy
4/9/2011-7:27am at 7:27 am (UTC -4)
this was discussed onthe radio yesterday. Whoever was announcing was talking about it being up to Sandy, and in their opinion, it would happen (lower/bring in). This was based on some of his comments, and the fact that he did it in his 2nd year with San Diego!
Me? I think the LF fence should get dropped to 8′, and the death valley in RC should be pulled in a bit. I also don’t like the jut out out there.
not sure about the mindset, but the team IS built for the place. Other than Bay, who should be, and Davis, who doesn’t have to be, it does seem to be a lot of use the field, liners up the gap types.
but, for a while, it won’t really matter since they aren’t going to be signing any big power hitters anyway.
metsfan4decades
4/9/2011-9:38am at 9:38 am (UTC -4)
I’d like to see that LF fence lowered too.
The jut in RF I’m ambivalent about but moving in the fence a bit might be a good idea but I’d go either way on that.
In general I would have preferred an average size field. I don’t care for the fields like Yankee stadium that have that RF porch where everything flies out of there. On the reverse, I don’t like the stadiums that are caverns either. Something in the middle. Something that power hitters have a chance and decent pitchers don’t have to compensate.