The New York Mets announced today after meeting with team orthopedist Dr. David Altchek that Johan Santana is not yet strong enough to continue his normal spring progression and therefore his throwing schedule will be pushed back to somewhere in the March 10-15 range. You can read the entire story here.
Feb 22
Johan Santana Throwing Schedule Is Pushed Back
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29 comments
Stick
2/22/2013-12:12pm at 12:12 pm (UTC -4)
this seems odd. I thought he had been working out over the winter, and was going to be even ready for the WBC?
I first thought when I saw the post that it was just a “save the bullets” plan, which I can certainly agree with (a guy like Johan should not need a lot of game action to be ready).
but if he is physically limited still, that sounds like an ominous sign.
HobokenMetsFan
2/22/2013-12:28pm at 12:28 pm (UTC -4)
Yea I agree with you, Stick. Something just does not add up here. Like you said, what happened to all that talk (from just last week!) about him wanting to play in the WBC and Sandy saying that “regardless if he plays or not, the fact he feels strong enough to play is a good sign,” ….and now this.
I’m looking forward to his contract being off the books. Not that I don’t like him, or value his efforts at the beginning of his contract, but I’m ready to turn the page and really see what Sandy and his team will do with a “clean payroll slate”
Stick
2/22/2013-12:33pm at 12:33 pm (UTC -4)
It will be interesting. Assuming Sandy even sticks around for it. And IMO, no way he stays past his contract, so 1 more year at most.
gategem
2/22/2013-12:40pm at 12:40 pm (UTC -4)
Similar to Donnie Walsh happily escaping the clutches of that idiot Dolan with the Knicks.
HobokenMetsFan
2/22/2013-12:57pm at 12:57 pm (UTC -4)
Anything in particular that gives you that impression?
TRS86
2/22/2013-12:59pm at 12:59 pm (UTC -4)
I just never got the impression to start with that he would be here long-term. I looked at him as getting the house in order and then handing it off to a protege.
Stick
2/22/2013-1:02pm at 1:02 pm (UTC -4)
What he said. My feelings exactly. He was a “fixer” that would not be staying long.
only problem is, it seems pretty clear that JP is the designated replacement since they extended him already for some strange reason.
Just hope my prediction that Jeffy plans to step up and take over, with JP as a well payed front man/fall guy, doesn’t come true!
HobokenMetsFan
2/22/2013-1:07pm at 1:07 pm (UTC -4)
I hope this whole experience has taught Jeff to stay they hell out of baseball operations (or at least, beyond what any normal owner should get involved in) and let the guys he hires run the show from there.
Stick
2/22/2013-1:24pm at 1:24 pm (UTC -4)
well, one can hope.
Actually, the best thing (and it scares me that I even suggest this!) might be for Fred to retire, and promote Jeff to the big chair. As long as he then hires a real business/baseball guy of some sort to fill his current COO role (say, Sandy, doing the job he was actually brought in to do!) and run the operation, while he just sits in the big office and pretends to be important, we all might be better off.
srt
2/22/2013-5:20pm at 5:20 pm (UTC -4)
‘I hope this whole experience has taught Jeff to stay they hell out of baseball operations (or at least, beyond what any normal owner should get involved in) and let the guys he hires run the show from there.’
I’m with you on this one.
gategem
2/22/2013-12:49pm at 12:49 pm (UTC -4)
I read that Johan did not throw over the winter and the only way you build up arm strength is through a regimen that includes throwing. After surgery the arm is never the same as it was previous to the injury so building the strength may require a more cautious program. Johan’s desire to pitch in the WBC was just whistling Dixie through his rear end (that reminds me of a great joke that’s just too vulgar to post in a family website). I assume he wanted to pitch for his country once more before Hugo Chavez dies of cancer.
gategem
2/22/2013-1:05pm at 1:05 pm (UTC -4)
“We expected he would have had a normal offseason and he did have a normal offseason with the exception of not throwing,” Alderson said. “His throwing program is somewhat behind, but the important thing is Altchek saw him yesterday. There’s no structural issue. There’s no shoulder issue, it’s just an overall conditioning issue as it relates to throwing.”
Stick
2/22/2013-1:06pm at 1:06 pm (UTC -4)
so IOW he is shot and won’t see the mound this year?
Stick
2/22/2013-2:00pm at 2:00 pm (UTC -4)
Eddie C. has a piece up about not expecting Johan opening day, though if he is not throwing (or I guess not throwing in real games) until mid-March, that makes sense.
Maybe a 4 man rotation to start the season, skilling his turn a few times?
I assume though if that is going to happen, he starts on the DL. Bring him back after the snow tour in Mid-April to Colorado and Minny.
and somehow, I really don’t think that 215 IP vesting option is in play this year!
srt
2/22/2013-5:22pm at 5:22 pm (UTC -4)
I wouldn’t do a 4 man rotation.
If Johan starts the season on the DL, I’d slide someone like McHugh into the 5th spot.
kingman 26
2/22/2013-2:48pm at 2:48 pm (UTC -4)
As I have already predicted, look for this all year….Johan will take his time, pace himself, probably take a 2-month vacation mid-season, so that he can have a good September and finish strong in hopes of getting another obscene contract which he will earn about 40% of.
Yeah, he was great once, but as he showed during the pre-trade negotiations, he is all about the dollars.
The sooner he is off this team, the better for the future.
Stick
2/22/2013-2:57pm at 2:57 pm (UTC -4)
I highly doubt he gets another long term deal. maybe if he makes 30 starts and stays strong all year someone will bite, but even then maybe not.
more likely, he becomes one of those guys that signs tempting base + incentive deals every year, and may or may not pitch.
Who was that guy from a few years ago (name begins with an “S” I am pretty sure) that was the poster child for this? Would occasionally pitch a really good 40 IP, then steal money the rest of the year and the next.
HobokenMetsFan
2/22/2013-3:01pm at 3:01 pm (UTC -4)
Sheets?
TRS86
2/22/2013-3:22pm at 3:22 pm (UTC -4)
Watch your language. PG-13 here.
HobokenMetsFan
2/22/2013-3:27pm at 3:27 pm (UTC -4)
lol as in Ben Sheets?
Stick
2/22/2013-4:06pm at 4:06 pm (UTC -4)
reminds me of the first time I went south of DC into central VA and saw a Sheetz gas station. almost ran off the road laughing at it.
Stick
2/22/2013-4:05pm at 4:05 pm (UTC -4)
that was him. Senior moment I guess. don’t get old, it sucks.
we used to have rousing debates on Sheets (I think TRS loved him). He would pitch just enough to suck some team into giving him a contract that he mostly just did not fulfil (stole $$), then somehow sucked another team in the next year, thinking this was the year he would be healthy and earn it.
HobokenMetsFan
2/22/2013-3:04pm at 3:04 pm (UTC -4)
I almost wouldn’t be surprised with a 6 man rotation happening, only because of Johan and Gee coming off injury, Niese reportedly doing better with 6 days vs. 5 days, and also limiting innings for the younger guys.
Will it happen? Doubtful, but Terry/Sandy seemed to like it at the end of last year and a few of the lower level affiliates use 6 man rotations.
Are the Mets daring enough to buck “conventional wisdom” and try something new?
TRS86
2/22/2013-3:16pm at 3:16 pm (UTC -4)
Keep Laffey Taffey in the pen and go with a modified 6 man rotation with Laffey filling in as long-relief and spot starter. Done.
Stick
2/22/2013-4:03pm at 4:03 pm (UTC -4)
yeah, I would think they will go with a normal 5 man, but use off days if needed to give him a breather (skip a turn).
and this team definitely needs a legit long man/spot starter in the pen. heffner or laughing gas most likely.
kingman 26
2/22/2013-4:44pm at 4:44 pm (UTC -4)
Well, while I think that is often tempting, to me it is a questionable idea, at least until Wheeler is ready—assuming everyone stays healthy, you get about 64 starts out of Harvey and Niese in a 5-man, and in a 6-man that becomes 54.
Whoever would get those extra 10 starts would surely be a very large level below Harvey and Niese.
And yes, I know that in the old days there were 4-man rotations, so perhaps today’s 5-man eventually gives way to a 6-man, but unless you have Gee or Marcum as the #6, it doesn’t work out well—now if Johan is healthy and pitching in Aug/Sept? Sure, go Harvey/Niese/Wheeler/Johan/Marcum/Gee and see how it works in order to keep guys from tiring out down the stretch.
But we know that ain’t happening!
Stick
2/22/2013-4:53pm at 4:53 pm (UTC -4)
I know you meant to say if Johan is healthy, not wheeler. never utter words like that about wheels again please.
and i agree about the extended rotation. You don’t want fewer starts from you best SPs. now, you might mix/match the back end to keep injury guys healthy, but not your top guys.
and if Johan is healthy and pitching well in August/September, it likely won’t matter since he will be doing it on another team! Unless of course the mets are in the playoff race, in which case, beat him like a rented mule!
kingman 26
2/22/2013-5:08pm at 5:08 pm (UTC -4)
YIKES! Holy hell, I cannot believe I wrote that!
I meant until Wheeler is READY and I quickly edited that.
Damn.
Stick
2/22/2013-6:15pm at 6:15 pm (UTC -4)
you could have let me think I was nuts. I just reread your prior comment, and couldn’t understand how the hell I misread it!