With the Yankees roster having been depleted by karma and the gods of baseball they have came into need of something the Mets have, LH players that can play the corner OF position or corner IF positions. My first thought is at least the Yankees have something to worry about. My second thought is how could this benefit the Mets?
With Wilmer Flores hopefully making gains on the 2B position many on TRDM have discussed Murphy’s potential availability Duda, while many of us may be torn on his offensive potential we all agree that 1B is his least bad defensive position and his ultimate future on the team is in question.
Could the Mets and the Yankees be a fit? The Mets currently are in need of OF, of course, so no help there really from the Yankees. However, they do have a disgruntle bullpen pitcher who cries for a change of scenery. The Great Joba. Chamberlain will be a FA at the end of the year and has expressed a desire to start again. The Yankees do not seem to be interested in him starting. While I have no idea if he could start or not it wouldn’t hurt to try him in that position early and still have him as a bullpen arm later or something useful in a trade at the deadline.
Murphy’s salary has already jumped to 3M for 2013 and I would be surprised to see the Mets commit more than that next year for his services. As for Duda, we know all the issues there. To me this seems like a logical fit. Would the Yankees and Mets get together on something like this? Most likely not. However it has happened before. Besides, other than Cowgill what else do I have to talk about right now.?
60 comments
greggofboken
3/7/2013-10:20am at 10:20 am (UTC -4)
Given their current state of affairs, Duda would be a better fit for them given his power and their dearth of it. Defensively, they’re a bad ball club right now, and adding Murphy (either at first or at third and then moving Youkilis) only accentuates that. Which is not to say that Duda wouldn’t as well…but at least he brings something else to the table.
Unfortunately, the Yankees don’t have anything the Mets need. Joba’s not nearly enough, and there’s no way they’re parting with Gardiner.
I think the Yanks bite the bullet and spring for Carlos Lee. Scott Rolen as a fallback.
TRS86
3/7/2013-10:24am at 10:24 am (UTC -4)
I am not sure that Joba isn’t enough for Duda but lets say he isn’t. You could have the Yankees add a B type player or my personal favorite, David Adams (hey he’s a UVA guy, can’t help it).
TRS86
3/7/2013-10:26am at 10:26 am (UTC -4)
Also, my thoughts with Murphy is that Youk will need time off and he can also play LF. Thus Murphy could become a super utility guy playing 1B, 2B and 3B. Yeah the Yankees could use power but Murphy could hit at many different spots in their lineup and is a good situation hitter which they don’t have either.
wanny
3/7/2013-10:38am at 10:38 am (UTC -4)
So much of this is ridiculous I don’t know where to begin.
TRS86
3/7/2013-10:40am at 10:40 am (UTC -4)
Thanks Wanny.
TX
3/7/2013-10:44am at 10:44 am (UTC -4)
Is Murph a fit for the Yanks? Yes, but they are unless you are getting a serviceable OF, I don’t see where there is a fit. Even for Joba, who hasn’t lived up to the hype, in my mind.
I see a fit with the White Sox, but that’s just me.
TRS86
3/7/2013-10:46am at 10:46 am (UTC -4)
Yeah, again there’s not much to this. I don’t see there being a move made. Just thinking that Murphy and Duda seem to fit what they are looking for more than what they have is what we are looking for.
srt
3/7/2013-10:49am at 10:49 am (UTC -4)
I don’t think Joba is worth either one of them.
Now…if they had an OF prospect they could spare, that would be different.
TRS86
3/7/2013-10:54am at 10:54 am (UTC -4)
They might have to add something but we are talking about Duda and or Murphy. Murphy’s value last time was a middle reliever if you remember when the Mets considered trading him .
greggofboken
3/7/2013-11:08am at 11:08 am (UTC -4)
For Luke Gregorson, yes? And seeing that that is what was offered, we elected to keep him.
Murphy averages a 2.2 WAR over the past three seasons. Gregorson’s a fine reliever but he’s just not that impactful. Murphy would have been a overpay in my book, by a decent margin.
srt
3/7/2013-11:36am at 11:36 am (UTC -4)
I just don’t like Joba – not sure he’s ever going to be anything more than a middling middle reliever.
I’m not saying no to a trade of maybe Duda or Murph. I just prefer something else in return. No need to add to Joba – Yanks can just keep him and offer something else.
darknova306
3/7/2013-10:49am at 10:49 am (UTC -4)
Could a couple of glorified and overrated first basemen that play out of position be a perfect fit for a team that needs a first baseman? Sure, I guess.
TRS86
3/7/2013-10:54am at 10:54 am (UTC -4)
Hey, give Murphy credit. He was a bad 3B playing out of position.
darknova306
3/7/2013-10:59am at 10:59 am (UTC -4)
Hah! That’s fair. My apologies to Daniel.
darknova306
3/7/2013-11:09am at 11:09 am (UTC -4)
Duda isn’t even a mediocre everyday major league player. At least he hasn’t shown himself to be one, so there wouldn’t be any return worth looking at for him. Granted, he’d have more value in a 1B/DH role than anywhere else on the diamond, but how much would you honestly give up for him if you were a rival GM? He has little value.
Murphy is a more well rounded player, though every aspect of his game is average or below average (but but… 40 doubles! rabble rabble). His mediocrity plays well at an offensively barren position, but he certainly wouldn’t add much of anything to the Yankees, especially when he’d have to shift to 1B or 3B, where his offense looks truly pathetic and his salary becomes super overvalued (now that the Skanks care about $ for the first time).
These players don’t bring back anything in a trade of enough value for me to say “yeah, you gotta do that”.
TRS86
3/7/2013-11:15am at 11:15 am (UTC -4)
True, I guess that’s why I thought Joba because I thought he might have more value at the deadline in trade than Duda.
darknova306
3/7/2013-11:43am at 11:43 am (UTC -4)
Eh, from the trade deadline perspective, I’d have to go with giving Duda a chance to maybe finally show something and build his own value. If he could find even a little power again, he could become valuable to an AL fringe contender at the deadline that’s looking to fill an empty DH spot.
Joba’s a straight up chump.
TX
3/7/2013-11:11am at 11:11 am (UTC -4)
I see possible fits in Milwaukee (1B), White Sox (3B), Maybe Minnestoa (2B), Oakland (3B), Maybe Colorado (2B) and possibly San Diego (2B). Other options either don’t have much to return (Houston, Yankers) or there isn’t a fit (Baltimore, Seattle, Arizona, Cleveland)
gategem
3/7/2013-11:26am at 11:26 am (UTC -4)
TRS, we have to consider that Joba was mishandled by the Yankees similar to the way the Mets have used some of their pitching prospects. Even though Joba also has had some injury problems and his personality is that of a jerk he still possesses a 95mph fastball and a curve and slider that cause hitters to talk to themselves. However, I don’t see Joba’s success as a starter. He tends to dial back on his fastball when he starts and becomes hittable. I consider Joba a much better talent than Duda but because of Joba’s issues not quite enough for Murphy.
Joe Gomes
3/7/2013-11:31am at 11:31 am (UTC -4)
So let me get this straight, we trade our LF starter for a BP arm when what we need are outfielders. Gotcha, it makes all the sense in the world now…nahhhh
wanny
3/7/2013-11:35am at 11:35 am (UTC -4)
don’t forget that the reliever is a free agent after this season and has pitched less than 50 IP in the last two season combined.
srt
3/7/2013-11:41am at 11:41 am (UTC -4)
That and I find no pressing need to help out the Yankees.
I’m going to enjoy watching them scramble to compete this season.
kingman 26
3/7/2013-11:50am at 11:50 am (UTC -4)
TRS, your last sentence definitely sums this up.
Duda was absolutely horrific in his little time at 1B–I was at a game when he dropped a little league foul popup when playing 1B. He’s not 1B. He may not be an OF, but he definitely is not a 1B.
In addition, while Duda may or may not be able to hit, right now he is–without any debate–our most established MLB OF.
This is truth.
Some like to act as though Cowgill is going to “blossom” based on a few early ST games, and otherwise we have Baxter, a career backup/nothing, Byrd, an old question mark, Kirk, who might not be an MLB player, and den Dekker, who might not be a AAA player.
How can we trade Duda for Joba, a huge question mark on and off the field?
And as much as I feel that Murph is a wad of mediocrity, are we ready to give 2B to Flores/Valdy/Turner?
I appreciate your comments, but this seems like a hugely questionable idea Chief.
wanny
3/7/2013-12:03pm at 12:03 pm (UTC -4)
Don’t you think most teams would trade one of the hitters likely to hit in the middle of its order (as sad as it may be in this case) for an oft-injured middle reliever headed for free agency?
TRS86
3/7/2013-12:14pm at 12:14 pm (UTC -4)
As I said, it seems more of a fit on the Yankees side than the Mets.
Boomer
3/7/2013-12:46pm at 12:46 pm (UTC -4)
Byrd is actually our most accomplished OFer hard as that may be to believe. But I don’t think he’s going anywhere.
TRS86
3/7/2013-12:57pm at 12:57 pm (UTC -4)
True, but he isn’t on the 40 man yet.
Boomer
3/7/2013-1:00pm at 1:00 pm (UTC -4)
Not yet. But unless one of his arms falls off he is going to be our starting RFer.
Come to think of it, he may be our starting RFer even if one of his arms does fall off.
kingman 26
3/7/2013-1:02pm at 1:02 pm (UTC -4)
No, not really true–at all. It would be true if this was the spring of 2011.
In 2011 Byrd was about the same player offensively as Duda was in 2012.
In 2012 Byrd was not playing at an MLB level.
Duda’s 2011 blew away Byrd’s last two years.
Based on the last two years Duda is far more accomplished than Byrd.
Boomer
3/7/2013-1:08pm at 1:08 pm (UTC -4)
Except for the part about actually playing the outfield where Duda is a walking (even when he’s running) train wreck.
We sometimes get so caught up in the offensive stats that we forget defense is half the game. Byrd is a very solid fielder with flashes of better. I’ll grant you he’s no spring chicken but he is still twice the fielder Duda is and probably every will be.
kingman 26
3/7/2013-1:50pm at 1:50 pm (UTC -4)
Oh I totally agree with that absolutely and positively and I like to use the same phrase that “defense is half the game”–but Byrd’s 2012 offense would not be compensated for by his being Clemente in the field.
Boomer
3/7/2013-2:29pm at 2:29 pm (UTC -4)
No question, Byrd had a down year last year and it certainly wasn’t helped by his suspension. But Duda wasn’t exactly Ted Williams.
I’ve got a feeling that Byrd is going to have a better all around year than Duda in 2013. Through today he is one of our better offensive players and Duda, well he’s not. Byrd is acting like a guy who knows he’s on his last chance and wants it badly. Duda still looks lost. I’d be thrilled to be wrong on this one as we really need Duda’s bat but he’s not filling me with confidence right now.
On the other hand, Harvey was brilliant today and he looks to be the real deal. I hope these young arms stay healthy cause they are the real core of this team.
greggofboken
3/7/2013-2:36pm at 2:36 pm (UTC -4)
Duda’s defensive WAR marks last year were the worst by a Met in any single season since Mo Vaughn.
Hard work.
kingman 26
3/7/2013-2:59pm at 2:59 pm (UTC -4)
Wow, did not realize that Gregg, but it does not surprise me…he is a horrible outfielder and a horrible first baseman.
And a slow runner.
And a dumb guy with weak plate discipline.
Other than that, he’s pretty good.
darknova306
3/7/2013-3:05pm at 3:05 pm (UTC -4)
And there’s zero chance Duda ever hits enough to overcome that. My goodness, he’s an atrocity.
gategem
3/7/2013-4:43pm at 4:43 pm (UTC -4)
I’ve watched Joba pitch this year and I’ve spoken to Yankees fans who confirmed my observation that Joba is once again throwing his upper 90’s fastball together with his knee bending curve and nasty slider. It’s a gamble but if Joba resumes pitching in relief as he did when he first was called up and was basically unhittable you can turn him around for a blue chip outfield prospect. But I can’t see the Yankees taking Duda. My gf uncle has a great mastiff that could play better defense than Duda.
kingman 26
3/7/2013-4:47pm at 4:47 pm (UTC -4)
Yeah, I appreciate TRS’ putting ideas out there, but despite the last two years I cannot imagine the Yanks trading Joba for Duda.
And I have a nice boston fern in the corner of my kitchen that has better range and is a bit faster than Duda.
greggofboken
3/7/2013-5:36pm at 5:36 pm (UTC -4)
In 4 seasons as a dedicated reliever, Chamberlain has logged over 30 innings once. While some of his peripherals are sharp, they don’t justify trading him for a regular position player in my view — even one as deeply flawed in the field as Duda.
gategem
3/8/2013-10:35pm at 10:35 pm (UTC -4)
This is a case where the stats don’t tell the entire story. For example look at Koufax from 1955 through 1960. Would you trade a Duda type for that player? Sometimes you have to look deeper than the stats.
TRS86
3/7/2013-5:59pm at 5:59 pm (UTC -4)
Well keep in mind they need a 1b right now too. He stands at 1b much better than in the OF.
Stick
3/7/2013-6:11pm at 6:11 pm (UTC -4)
Duda also should hit quite a few HRs with that short porch. Built for the place.
gategem
3/8/2013-10:40pm at 10:40 pm (UTC -4)
Before you make that statement you should give it some credence by showing that Duda has warning track power to right field at Citi that would reach the seats at Yankee Stadium. I don’t believe that is the case so Duda would probably be just as much a stiff with the Yankees as with the Mets.
gategem
3/8/2013-10:47pm at 10:47 pm (UTC -4)
As long as all he has to do is stand there he should be fine in the OF too. The problem is he’s not posing for a statue or a portrait. During the short time he played first he fell over his own feet a few times, show poor manual dexterity and reflexes and the quickness of molasses. Ron Darling noticed he was a poor 1st baseman and said so on a couple of post game shows.
Stick
3/8/2013-11:15pm at 11:15 pm (UTC -4)
the guy in enormous but can’t even move a couch without hurting himself, so what do you expect?
Stick
3/7/2013-1:05pm at 1:05 pm (UTC -4)
well, an interesting topic for the morning. I see a couple of seperate issues being entwined here.
1) the Yankees need a LH corner guy. But, screw them, that is there problem!
2) I want no part of Joba and his breaking bad mama. Does nothing for the Mets. But, if the Yankees had something useful they would part with (a promising, just about ready OF say), that would be a different discussion.
3) Should the mets trade Murphy of Duda? I would say, in the right deal for the right return, both are expendable.
Duda, as everyone knows, is still one of my favorites, but I will sacrifice his bat (which I still think can be very productive) to upgrade the D. And even the guys on hand being mixed/match can just as easily cover LF too, and give a big lift to the pitchers! Makes the team even more power deficient, but probably much quicker and certainly much better D.
Murphy, that is more of an immediate hurt, but I am not a long term fan of his as a player, Would really mean they are comfortable sending Flores to Vegas to be a FT 2B, and would consider Spin or the fill-in stiffs (Hicks, Turner) covering in the interim. But, again, if he could bring back a real OF or valuable prospect, go for it.
bottom line, all these moves are just about 2014 anyway, so plan them around next OD, not this one!
kingman 26
3/7/2013-3:07pm at 3:07 pm (UTC -4)
Really, at this point, I have decided to enjoy 2013 with zero expectations–screw Fred and Jeff—I have more seniority with the Mets than either of those a**holes do–my Dad took me to my first game in 1970! And unlike Jeff, I went to college and know what the hell I am doing in my business. And I have much nicer hair than he does.
Sandy? I honestly do not know if he is 100% honest, 100% full of Wilpon (see what I did there?) or somewhere in the middle. Did he really try to sign Dickey and Bourn? Who cares.
I love Harvey and Wheeler and Niese and d’Oorknob and Shingaaaard, and feel that those five could be the CORE of the next great Met teams.
I love Flores and Montero, I think Ike and Tejada and the Golden Dimpled One can be valuable parts of a great team, and I still have hope for Parnell.
So I am treating this as if it was spring training 1983. Zero expectations, I expect them to suck, I know there are some fine young pieces on the team and in the minors, and I am reminding myself that Met baseball is one of my favorite things in life, and I am not going to let the Wilpons or their errand boy Sandy ruin it for me.
Hmmmm, this would be a nice post…
darknova306
3/7/2013-3:21pm at 3:21 pm (UTC -4)
Did you ever see that sketch on MadTV called Lowered Expectations? It was about a video dating service for social misfits that needed to lower their expectations for what they could get. Freakin’ hilarious stuff. Your post just kinda reminded me of that.
And ‘full of Wilpon’ is fantastic. That just made my day!
Stick
3/7/2013-3:30pm at 3:30 pm (UTC -4)
I am not expecting it anytime soon, but I honestly wonder what would happen to the fanbase (and the blogsphere) if they dropped a bombshell one day that they just struck a deal to sell the entire team. Don’t even care who it was to.
damned, the entire internet would probably explode and burn to the ground.
though by day 2, a fair number of fans would probably be back to pissing and moaning about everything anyway, but some people are just miserable no matter what.
kingman 26
3/7/2013-4:52pm at 4:52 pm (UTC -4)
Totally depends on who it would be—Mark Cuban would be a dream, but a scumbag company-destroying egomaniacal money-loving piece of Wilpon like Einhorn could be worse than the Wilpons.
Selling to a hedge fund criminal is no improvement.
Selling to a sports-loving person who actually BUILT something and created jobs and has a healthy view of life like Cuban would be the dream.
Stick
3/7/2013-5:54pm at 5:54 pm (UTC -4)
since Bud seems hell bent on keeping Cuban out of the old buys club, I would say the odds are high that a new one would be some corporate/conglomerate types, and odds of being a hedge fund guy even higher.
not many people have a spare billion lying around!
Boomer
3/7/2013-6:25pm at 6:25 pm (UTC -4)
Not for nothing but Broadcast.com, the company that Cuban sold to Yahoo for $5.9 billion, never made a nickel in profit. It was just one of many dot com hyped nothings that was sold on ‘what a great idea!!”. Yahoo has since shut down Broadcast.com. Just one of many reasons Yahoo got its butt handed to it by Google.
And Cuban still has an open case with the SEC for insider trading. Not exactly the paragon of virtue.
He’s a big sports lover and spends on his team, no doubt. But his business genius is more a case of right place, right time.
darknova306
3/7/2013-9:56pm at 9:56 pm (UTC -4)
It’s funny, Stick, how much of your thinking about the Mets revolves around the MMO commenters that you hate so much. Do you just love getting angry at other people’s opinions that disagree with you? Who gives a fu*k what “the fanbase” would think about the team getting sold?
Stick
3/7/2013-10:21pm at 10:21 pm (UTC -4)
don’t get you panties in a bunch. That was a generic, non-denominational comment as to the nature of the mets internet universe at this point.
gategem
3/7/2013-10:28pm at 10:28 pm (UTC -4)
Dark, I visited MMO the other day and to my surprise they’ve posted an image of a stop sign with the accompanying words, “No Insults, No Profanity, No Instigating” followed by the words proudly proclaiming “8 Banned and Growing….” I found this so incredibly amateurish and childish that in honor of Joe D. and the people here that post over there and bring their discussions about it here I changed my avatar to the character you see now.
darknova306
3/7/2013-11:31pm at 11:31 pm (UTC -4)
Doesn’t matter if you’re whining about MMO or other more general folks. You spend way too much time and effort worrying about the opinions of fans that don’t comment here. If they bother you, go complain to them directly, not here. No one here should care what some idiots somewhere else think about the Mets unless those idiots comment here. Their opinions aren’t worth our time.
srt
3/8/2013-7:36am at 7:36 am (UTC -4)
I didn’t get the impression stick is worrying about any comments from Met fans…just curious as to what their reaction would be. Haven’t seen stick comment on MMO in a very long time but don’t know if he reads over there.
No different I would think than the occasional comment some us make about WFAN callers and what Francesa gets them all spun up about.
IMO this is still the best site to debate all things NY Mets without being subjected to the lunatic fringe type fan. That doesn’t mean though we operate in a vacuum here. Some of us do a lot of reading on the net about baseball and the Mets and share some of those articles, impressions and yes, even fan sentiment.
Besides…if the Wilpons did wind up selling you can probably bet we’d be spending much time discussing that here. I, for one, live for the day I see that announcement.
Stick
3/7/2013-3:34pm at 3:34 pm (UTC -4)
Knog, that sounds close to my philosophy. I like the Mets, like discussing the Mets, and enjoy watching the games. I’m hooked.
and yes, I would love to see them have another big year and make a WS run.
but, I don’t take it personally if they don’t. I focus on whatever positives there are, discuss the team, watch the games, and pass on getting an ulcer. I also try to be pragmatic, and not bitch and moan constantly about things that will not change (such as who the owners are).
Basically, take what you got and work with it.
srt
3/7/2013-3:44pm at 3:44 pm (UTC -4)
Agree with both of you guys.
I’m just going to enjoy the season.
TX
3/7/2013-4:42pm at 4:42 pm (UTC -4)
Is that Yankee hat backwards on purpose to show disrespect? If so, good show, Watson.
Hazmet
3/7/2013-7:46pm at 7:46 pm (UTC -4)
Yes they could certainly fit well in Columbus.